Monday, February 26, 2018

Ralph Martin, Fr.Gerald Collins, Eduardo Echeverria,Gavin D'Costa and others make an objective mistake in the Homilectic and Pastoral Review

from Homilectic and Pastoral Review

Art for Conflicting Interpretations of Lumen Gentium 16 by Echeverria

Conflicting Interpretations of Lumen Gentium 16

Fr. Gerald O’Collins, S.J., has recently claimed that Ralph Martin “egregiously misrepresents Vatican II’s teaching {in LG 16}.”1 How so? What exactly does LG 16 state, according to O’Collins? Here’s the crux of O’Collins’ charge against what he calls Martin’s “chilling thesis”:
Martin simply moves beyond what Vatican II states here {LG 16}, when he claims an impossibility, and maintains that very often people who have never heard the gospel cannot be saved. If they live deprived of the conditions under which they can be saved, that means that they will not be saved, and will finish up damned for all eternity. If they cannot be saved, they will not, in fact, be saved. This is a frightening thesis, tantamount to the extreme Augustinian view that God creates a massa damnata: the majority of the human race are simply predestined to hell.2
Lionel: Theologians Collins and Martin are talking in terms of hypothethicals and are playing God.In a way this was the major exercise at Vatican Council II. They kept speculating as if their speculation referred to known people who were saved as such or who would be saved as they speculated.
We have to keep in mind that for Ralph Martin, possibilities in the past are not just hypothetical in 2018 or in real life. They are real people ,real examples of salvation outside the Church. So they are exceptions to the Feeneyite interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS). So for Martin invincible ignorance is an exception to Feeneyite EENS. LG 16 is an exception to EENS, the past ecclesiology and the Syllabus of Errors.These are Church teachings and documents which he no more can affirm as a Catholic. It would contradict the new ecumenism and new ecclesiology which he teaches at the Sacred Heart Major Seminary Detroit.
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To discuss O’Collins’ interpretation, and Martin’s criticism, of the received interpretation of LG 16, we should have the text in question before us. I follow Martin’s identification of each paragraph of LG 16 as a, b, and c.
(a) Those who have not yet received the gospel are related in various ways to the people of God. There is, first, that people to which the covenants and promises were made, and from which Christ was born according to the flesh (cf. Rom 9:4-5): in view of the divine choice, they are a people most dear for the sake of the fathers, for the gifts of God are without repentance (cf. Rom 11:29-36). But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst whom are the Moslems: these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us, they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day. Nor is God remote from those who, in shadows and images, seek the unknown God, since he gives to all men life and breath and all things (cf. Acts 17:25-28), and as Savior wills that all men be saved (cf. 1 Tim 2:4).
(Speculation. We do not know a single such case in real life).
(b) Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ, or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those, too, may achieve eternal salvation. Nor shall Divine Providence deny the assistance necessary for salvation to those who, without any fault of theirs, have not yet arrived at an explicit knowledge of God, and who, not without his grace, strive to live a good life. Whatever good or truth is found amongst them is considered by the Church to be a preparation for the Gospel, and given by him who enlightens all men so that they may finally have life.
(O.K one is free to speculate. We do not know a single such case in real life. So the theorizing is not an exception or relevant to the dogma EENS as it was known for example to the missionaries and Magisterium in the 16th century.)
(c) But very often {at saepius} men, deceived by the Evil One, have become vain in their reasonings, have exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and served the world rather than the Creator. Or else, living and dying in this world without God, they are exposed to ultimate despair. Wherefore, to promote the glory of God, and procure the salvation of all of these, and mindful of the command of the Lord, “Preach the Gospel to every creature” (Mark 16:16), the Church fosters the missions with care and attention.3
(O.K this could be a reason to preach the Gospel. But Ralph Martin can no more say that all non Catholics are on the way to Hell unless they are incorporated into the Church as members, with faith and baptism(AG 7).Since for him hypothetical cases are explicit exceptions to the strict interpretation of EENS. So he puts forward this personal theory for mission.He has rejected the traditional theology and reason for mission.
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The concluding paragraph of LG 13 is the context for understanding this text. It states:
All men are called to belong to the new People of God … This characteristic of universality, which adorns the People of God, is a gift from the Lord himself. By reason of it, the Catholic Church strives energetically and constantly to bring all humanity, with all its riches, back to Christ its Head, in the unity of his Spirit … All men are called to be part of this catholic unity of the People of God, a unity which is harbinger of the universal peace it promotes. And there belong to it ,or are related to it, in various ways, the Catholic faithful as well as all who believe in Christ, and, indeed, the whole of mankind. For all men are called to salvation by the grace of God (emphasis added).
The main presupposition here is that faith, baptism, and the Church are necessary for salvation. This is explicitly stated in LG 14. 
Here the orthodox teaching on salvation and mission are supported but it will be contradicted in by assuming  hypothetical cases are objectively known in the present times.So it is then postulated that there is known salvation outside the Church(LG14, LG 15 etc)
For me LG 14 and LG 15 do not refer to known people saved outside the Church.They mention hypothetical cases only because of the original mistake in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 which was overlooked at Vatican Council II. How can we humans see or know someone in 2018 who has been saved without faith and baptism? How can there be practical exceptions to EENS and the past ecclesiology of the Church?
The norm for salvation is faith and baptism and not invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire and baptism of blood.
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You can read the rest of the article. The same irrational premise is used.Then upon this false premise a new theology is created.It is based on an objective mistake in observation and empirical mistake. It violates the Principle of Non Contradiction.It is magisterial and officially taught at the pontifical universities and seminaries.
This is also how Vatican Council II is interpreted as the secular universities.-Lionel Andrades
Continued
http://www.hprweb.com/2016/06/conflicting-interpretations-of-lumen-gentium-16/

 FEBRUARY 26, 2018


When you read the text of Vatican Council II do not read the text as being for and against extra ecclesiam nulla salus (EENS). This would mean you are using the false premise

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/02/when-you-read-text-of-vatican-council.html


FEBRUARY 24, 2018



SSPX begin negotiations with Abp. Guido Pozzo : ask if Vatican Council II can be interpreted with the Lionel Andrades model.

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/02/sspx-begin-negotiations-with-abp-guido.html



FEBRUARY 26, 2018


Abp Guido Pozzo, Secretary of Ecclesia Dei,Vatican interprets Vatican Council II irrationally and so there is the hermeneutic of rupture. He wanted the SSPX to interpret the Council like him and then sign a Doctrinal Preamble.

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2018/02/ralph-martin-frgerald-collins-eduardo.html

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