Tuesday, June 20, 2017

Raymond de Souza at EWTN and HLI also says invisible people are visible exceptions to EENS : affirms Cushingite theology

Our Catholic Faith

An Apologetics Course… “Outside The Church There Is No Salvation”

January 10, 2016

By RAYMOND DE SOUZA, KM
The sentence that reads “extra Ecclesiam nulla salus,” that is, “outside of the Church there is no salvation,” is attributed to St. Cyprian, rather of the Church (Epistle 73, c. 21, Origen, homily in Josue, 3, 4).
It has been confirmed in different ways by Popes over the centuries, and naturally has been a source of ardent controversy for centuries as well, especially by those who left Catholicism and created their own churches that were more in line with their doctrinal and moral preferences.
In the next few articles, we shall face the challenge and expound Church teaching on this controversial matter.
First, let us establish some basic principles, some common ground upon which to build the argument:
Because of original sin, the gates of Heaven were closed to mankind. Before the death of Christ, those who died in a state of grace could not enter Heaven. By faith and contrition, they were justified (i.e., made just and righteous), but after death they had to wait in the “Limbo of the Fathers,” also called the Bosom of Abraham (Luke 19:22). They were unable to merit grace, but received it on Earth in consideration of the merits of the Redeemer to come. So, until the Redeemer’s death, they could not receive its chief benefit, the vision of God in Heaven.
Through the work of the Holy Spirit, the Blessed Virgin Mary conceived the Savior in her sacred womb and gave birth to Him. He fulfilled His mission, founded His Church, and commanded His apostles to preach His Gospel to all in the world. They were to preach and baptize them. Those who believed and practiced the contents of the preaching and received Baptism would be saved; those who refused would be condemned. It’s as simple as that.
Lionel: Agreed.
______________
Therefore, in plain English, our Savior, Jesus Christ, God Incarnate, commanded that all were to be members of His Church. Those who deliberately — meaning knowingly and willingly — disobey Him will be lost eternally.
Lionel: They also will be lost. However all non Catholics in general are on the way to Hell and not only those who are not invincible ignorance.We cannot judge who is in invincible ignorance and will be saved. So this is a non-issue with reference to the dogma outside the Church there is no salvation.It is a mistake supported by the Baltimore Catechism, the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 and Vatican Council II.
________________
 
Raymond
 
But — and this “but” is of paramount importance — since He wants the salvation of all men and condemns no one except for a grave fault, He will not condemn those who through non-culpable ignorance are unaware of His commandment, or have never heard of His Church.
Lionel: There are no known cases of someone saved in invincible ignorance who did not need the baptism of water. So invincible ignorance is not an exception to all needing to be members of the Church to avoid Hell.Superflous passages in Vatican Council II (LG 14 etc) mention this.
_________________

 These people, who endeavor to serve Him faithfully according to their well-informed conscience, act as the just of the Old Testament did. They have a sincere desire to do His will and, therefore, implicitly, the desire to become members of His Church.
Lionel: As speculation with good will this is fine.However it is understood that these are theoretical cases for us since only God can see who is in Heaven. Theoretical cases are not explicit exceptions to the dogma on exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church.If someone is not part of our reality on earth he cannot be an exception to all needing to enter the Church for salvation.
________________

When the rich man asked Jesus what he should do to obtain eternal life, Jesus replied, “Keep the Commandments.” The Commandments are the codification of God’s will.
If so, then who was the ancient sentence, “Outside the Church there is no salvation,” addressed to? It was not addressed to those who have never heard of His Church: It was addressed to those already in the Church, who might be tempted to join heretical bodies or abandon the faith to something more appetizing.
Lionel: It was also addressed to them. It was based on Jesus' teaching in John 3:5 and Mark 16:16. The Council of Trent said that those who say that the baptism of water is not necessary for salvation let him be anathema.
Pope Benedict XVI in the Catechism of the Catholic Church(1257, 846) and the Avvenire interview( March 2016) indicates there are exceptions to all needing the baptism of water in the Catholic Church for salvation. This is heresy.It is based on being able to see invisible people saved outside the Church.
Cushingites assume there are known exceptions to all needing the baptism of water.They contradict Jesus in the Bible.They contradict the popes and saints of the past.
________________

SGC-I
 
Once you are a baptized Catholic, do not fool yourself into thinking that you can obtain salvation outside of the Catholic Church. Once you are in the Ark of Noah, do not fool yourself into thinking that you can jump overboard and row your own little boat into the nearest safe haven.
The sentence of St. Cyprian was not intended to mean that all those who do not belong to the Catholic Church, regardless of their knowing of her existence or not, are necessarily condemned. It was not a statement that all non-Catholics were automatically condemned without any fault of their own.
Lionel: For the 16th century missionaries - everyone needed  to enter the Church or they would be automatically lost to Hell.This still is the traditional teaching after Vatican Council II with Feeneyite theology.It is not the teaching after Vatican Council II if your perspective is Cushingite.
_______________

Pope Pius XII appealed thus to non-Catholics:
“We invite them all, each and every one, to yield their free consent to the inner stirrings of God’s grace and strive to extricate themselves from a state in which they cannot be secure of their own eternal salvation; for, though they may be related to the Mystical Body of the Redeemer by some unconscious yearning and desire, yet they are deprived of those many great heavenly gifts and helps which can be enjoyed only in the Catholic Church.
“Let them enter Catholic unity, therefore, and joined with us in the one organism of the Body of Jesus Christ, hasten together to the one Head in the fellowship of most glorious love. We cease not to pray for them to the Spirit of love and truth, and with open arms we await them, not as strangers, but as those who are coming to their own father’s house” (Mystici Corporis Christi, 1943, part III).
Lionel: Pope Pius XII does not state that someone with an unconscious yearning is a known case and so is an exception to the dogma EENS. This was wrongly inferred by liberal theologians. The result of this wrong thinking  is that today  we have two interpretations of Vatican Council II.One is rational and the other irrational, one is Feeneyite and the other Cushingite.
_______________

Hence all Catholics are called to be missionaries, to invite those outside of the Church to join the Bark of Peter.
Lionel: Yes but only with traditional Feeneyite theology and not the Cushingite theology of Raymond De Souza.You do not do mission assuming there is salvation outside the Church.You do not do mission assuming  invisible and unknown people oustide the Catholic Church are examples of salvation outside the Church.You cannot call people into the Church and also suggest that there is a possibility of the person being saved outside the Church in his own religion.This is contradictory.It is Cushingite.
_______________

 Those self-righteous ones among us, who assert that salvation resides exclusively in the membership of Catholic parishes but do nothing to bring others into them, jeopardize their own salvation. Yes, the Church is necessary for salvation, and those people who know that she was founded by Christ but still prefer a church of their own, also jeopardize their souls.
Lionel: This is Cushingite theology. It is based on invisible baptism of desire and blood and being saved in invincible ignorance being visible exceptions to the dogma EENS.Something that was irrelevant was made relevant.
_______________

We have a confirmation of this teaching in the Second Vatican Council, which twice declared the necessity of the Church for salvation: “Hence those people could not be saved, who, not ignorant that the Catholic Church has been founded as necessary by God through Jesus Christ, would still refuse either to enter it or to remain in it” (Lumen Gentium, 1964, art. 14; Ad Gentes, 1965, art. 7).
Lionel: This is a Cushingite passage which comes from the error in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949. The Letter assumed being saved in invincible ignorance was an exception to the Feeneyite interpretation of the dogma EENS. In other words there were known cases of people saved outside the Church without the baptism of water.
______________

Two Cases
Let us consider the following cases:
A man, born of Protestant parents, is baptized; lives his life as a Protestant; endeavors to keep the Commandments, without ever having a grave doubt that he is in the wrong; before death, he begs God for an act of perfect contrition for his sins, or an act of perfect charity. We can assume that he died in the state of grace.
I am not oversimplifying the case. That man must have kept the Commandments, really and truly. He must not have followed Luther’s exhortation to sin on bravely, but believe even more strongly (“pecca fortiter, sed crede fortius”). His Protestant faith did not save him, but his fidelity to the Commandments — which he learned through the Catholic Church — did. He is saved not because of his heresy, but in spite of it.
Lionel: A speculative case. It has no connection to Feeneyite EENS.
_______________

A second case: a heathen who has never heard the name of Christ. He obeys the natural law according to his lights. He dies a heathen, to all appearances. The Divine Mercy will not suffer such a man to be lost. It is a recognized principle that God, because He wills that all be saved, does not deny grace to him who does his best. He will infallibly give him who is faithful to the natural law sufficient illumination and enable him to make the acts of faith and charity necessary for salvation.
Lionel: A theoretical case with no exception to EENS.
-Lionel Andrades
______________

In the next article, we consider the objection: Why try to convert people, then?

+ + +
(Raymond de Souza is an EWTN program host; regional coordinator for Portuguese-speaking countries for Human Life International [HLI]; president of the Sacred Heart Institute, and a member of the Sovereign, Military, and Hospitaller Order of the Knights of Malta. His website is: www.RaymonddeSouza.com.)

EWTN is in a rupture with the magisterium of the 16th century according to Pope Benedict XVI

Outside The Church There Is No Salvation

Image result for Photo of EWTN Colin DonovanEWTN Logo

The doctrine that "Outside the Church there is no salvation" is one that is constantly misinterpreted by those who won't submit to the Magisterium of the Church.
Lionel: It is the magisterium since the time of Pope Pius XII which insists invisible people are visible exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.The conclusion and inference is irrational.It is also a break with the magisterium in the 16th century. This was confirmed by Pope Benedict XVI in March 2016. This would be heresy for the magisterium in the 16 the century. Pope Benedict does not deny it.Also the heresy comes from assuming that  invisible people are objective exceptions to the 16th century understanding of extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
This is a de fide teaching which is being changed or denied. It is first class heresy. It is a mortal sin.

________________________

 Faith does not depend upon our ability to reason to the truth but on our humility before the Truth presented to us by those to whom Christ entrusted that task. This is why the First Vatican Council taught that it is the task of the Magisterium ALONE to determine and expound the meaning of the Tradition - including "outside the Church no salvation."
Lionel: Yes and the present magisterium contradicts the past magisterium because of an alleged 'development' with Vatican Council II according to Pope Benedict.So at one time the magisterium is wrong, before or after Pope Pius XII.
________________________

Concerning this doctrine the Pope of Vatican I, Pius IX, spoke on two different occasions. In an allocution (address to an audience) on December 9th, 1854 he said:
We must hold as of the faith, that out of the Apostolic Roman Church there is no salvation; that she is the only ark of safety, and whosoever is not in her perishes in the deluge; we must also, on the other hand, recognize with certainty that those who are invincible in ignorance of the true religion are not guilty for this in the eyes of the Lord. And who would presume to mark out the limits of this ignorance according to the character and diversity of peoples, countries, minds and the rest?
Lionel: Pius IX does not state here that'those who are in invincible ignorance of the true religion and are not guilty for this in the eyes of the Lord,'are visible in the flesh cases.Obviously they cannot be known to us and would be known only to God. But EWTN assumes that this is a reference to a known case.Since only a known case could be an exception to the dogma EENS. An invisible person cannot be an exception to the teaching on all needing to be members of the Church for salvation.For example if there was a case of someone saved outside the Church in 2017 then this would be an exception to the Feeneyite interpretation of the dogma no salvation outside the Church. But where are these cases? There are none.So this is a false inference by EWTN.
________________________
 

Again, in his encyclical Quanto conficiamur moerore of 10 August, 1863 addressed to the Italian bishops, he said:
It is known to us and to you that those who are in invincible ignorance of our most holy religion, but who observe carefully the natural law, and the precepts graven by God upon the hearts of all men, and who being disposed to obey God lead an honest and upright life, may, aided by the light of divine grace, attain to eternal life; for God who sees clearly, searches and knows the heart, the disposition, the thoughts and intentions of each, in His supreme mercy and goodness by no means permits that anyone suffer eternal punishment, who has not of his own free will fallen into sin.
Lionel: Again this is a reference to a hypothetical case.The text does not state that this is a reference to a known person, someone personally known.It is inferred wrongly by EWTN that this is an exception to the dogma.The pope is referring with good will to a hypothetical case.This is something obvious. Yet the liberal theologians misinterpret  someone who is theoretically in Heaven to be practically on earth and known.Upon this irrationality  is based the new theology approved by Rahner and Ratzinger.Fantasy theology !
________________________________________


These statements are consistent with the understanding of the Church contained in the documents of Vatican II, and the Catechism of the Catholic Church,
Lionel: No they are not!. They are only consistent ( in error)
 if the same Cushingite theology is used to interpret all these documents including the understanding of EENS.
 I interpret all these magisterial documents consistently by omitting the false premise. I do not confuse invisible people as being objectively seen or known.I do not assume that there is known salvation outside the Church since invisible baptism of desire is a visible exception to the old ecclesiology.For me Vatican Council II, the Catechism of the Catholic Church and EENS is Feeneyite.So it is consistent.It is also rational and traditional.
_____________________________________

 as well as explaining why the rigorist position of Fr. Feeney (that all must be actual members of the Catholic Church to be saved) has been condemned by the Magisterium.
Lionel: Yes the rigorist position of EENS was condemned by a Magisterium which assumed invisible people are objective exceptions to the Feeneyite interpretation of EENS.This is also the reasoning of EWTN and the two living popes.They all violate the Principle of Non Contradiction and are a rupture with the magisterium of the 16th century according to Pope Benedict XVI( Avvenire, March 2016).
So this is all contradictory. It is not rational, traditional or Catholic. It is a deception which has been brought into the Church.It has unfortunately had the support of Archbishop Lefebvre and the SSPX priests and bishops who have had their formation under him. He had wrongly interpreted Vatican Council II assuming hypothetical cases( LG 16, LG 8, UR 3, GS 22, NA 2 etc) are objectively known cases. He picked up the error of the 1949 Letter during the pontificate of Pope Pius XII.
_______________________________________

 It is ironic that precisely those who know their obligation to remain united to the Magisterium, and thus on whom this doctrine is morally binding, keep themselves from union with the Roman See on this point.
Lionel:The magisterium was in heresy and was forcing this heresy upon Fr. Leonard Feeney.It was Cardinal Richard Cushing and the Jesuits at Vatican Council II who were in heresy.It was blatant public heresy and the popes did nothing.
 These liberals  placed this irrational philosophy and theology in Vatican Council II. There are so many superfluous passages in Vatican Council II which mention being saved in invincible ignorance and the case of the catechumen who desires the baptism of water before he died.These are hypothetical cases.The case of the catechumen is an imaginary case.So they were always irrelevant to the dogma EENS.
-Lionel Andrades

Answered by Colin B. Donovan, STL

Catholic Answers keep assuming invisible people are visible exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus

What "No Salvation Outside the Church" Means

August 13, 2011
One of the most misunderstood teachings of the Catholic Church is this one:

"Outside the Church there is no salvation" (Extra ecclesiam nulla salus).

Those trying to grasp the meaning of this teaching often struggle with its formulations by various Church Fathers and Church Councils down through history. Of course, to understand an isolated formulation of any Church teaching, one must study the historical context within which it was written: why it was written, what was going on in the Church at the time, who the intended audience was, and so on. One must discover how the magisterium (teaching office) of the Church understands its own teaching. If someone fails to do this and chooses, rather, to simply treat a particular formulation as a stand-alone teaching, he runs the risk of seriously misunderstanding it.
Lionel: For Jim Blackburn and Catholic Answers invisible baptism of desire is a visible exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. This is also the reasoning of popes, cardinals and bishops.
______________________________

In recent times, the Church has recognized that its teaching about the necessity of the Catholic Church for salvation has been widely misunderstood, so it has "re-formulated" this teaching in a positive way. Here is how the Catechism of the Catholic Church begins to address this topic: "How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers? Reformulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body" (CCC 846).
Lionel: It accomodates the error. It assumes invisible baptism of desire is a visible exceptions to the dogma EENS. This is an objective error.It is misleading by Catholic Answers. Since they have been informed about this many times over the years.Yet they keep repeating the lie.
If this is the teaching of the popes then they should admit that the popes made an objective error. Even a young boy would know that invisible people cannot be visible exceptions to the dogma EENS in 2017 or in the past.
So why do they continue with this propaganda and lie.Why do the secular authorities not do something about this ? How can Catholic Answers keep repeating this lie which is offensive to discerning Catholics.
When it is pointed out to them they do not comment. But go back to repeating the falsehood.
______________________________

In keeping with the Church’s current spirit of ecumenism, this positive reformulation comes across less harshly than previous negative formulations. Even so, it remains quite controversial. So, let’s see how this new formulation squares with Scripture.
Jesus, the Way

The first part of the reformulated teaching—"all salvation comes from Christ the Head"—is quite easy for all Christians, even non-Catholics, to understand and embrace. It echoes Jesus’ own words recorded by John: "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me" (Jn 14:6). So, Christians unanimously agree on this first part. But is this all that needs to be said about how one may be saved? The Catholic Church has historically recognized the importance of explaining further the means through which salvation is offered through Christ.
Lionel: Dominus Iesus says that we cannot separate the Church from the Kingdom of God and we know historically the Church was not separated from Jesus.
Vatican Council II and the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 is based on the New Theology, Cushingism, which separates Jesus from the Church on the issue of salvation.Since it was wrongly assumed that invisible cases were visible cases to the dogma EENS.
If we omit this false premise( invisible people are visible) then Vatican Council II can be re-interpreted in harmony with the strict interpretation of the dogma EENS.
_______________________________

When speaking of salvation, Jesus offered more details than just his words quoted above. For example, consider these three verses:
  • He who believes and is baptized will be saved. (Mk 16:16)
  • [U]nless you repent you will all likewise perish. (Lk 13:3)
  • [H]e who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. (Jn 6:54)
Notice that in these three verses Jesus associated salvation with baptism, confession, and the Eucharist, respectively. Catholics recognize that these sacraments are administered through the Church. In fact, in the case of the latter two, a validly ordained priest is necessary for their administration, so the sacrament of ordination must also be associated with salvation. A primary role of the Catholic Church in conjunction with salvation is becoming quite clear.
Lionel: Yes there is no separation.
_________________________________

This brings us to the second part of the Catechism’s formulation of the doctrine being considered: ". . . through the Church which is his Body."

With Him or Against Him


Since the sacraments are the ordinary means through which Christ offers the grace necessary for salvation, and the Catholic Church that Christ established is the ordinary minister of those sacraments, it is appropriate to state that salvation comes through the Church.
Lionel: Yes but only for those who believe in the teachings of the Church and are members of the Catholic Church.There was always an exclusivist ecclesiology in the Church before the Letter of the Holy Office 1949.
____________________________________

This is not unlike the situation that existed prior to the establishment of the Catholic Church. Even before it was fully revealed that he was the Messiah, Jesus himself taught that "salvation is from the Jews" (Jn 4:22). He pointed the woman of Samaria to the body of believers existing at that time, through which salvation would be offered to all mankind: the Jews.

In a similar fashion, now that the Messiah has established his Church, Jesus might say, "salvation is from the Catholics"!
Lionel: This would be the New Theology, Cushingite theology.It would be an innovation in the Church.
______________________________________

Recognizing this, we can see why the Church, especially during times of mass exodus (such as has happened in times when heresies have run rampant), has been even more forceful in the way it has taught this doctrine. Instead of simply pointing out how God offers salvation from Christ, through the Church, the Church has warned that there is no salvation apart from Christ, outside his Church.

Since Jesus established the Catholic Church as necessary for salvation, those who knowingly and willingly reject him or his Church cannot be saved. We see this in Jesus’ teaching: "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters" (Mt 12:30). Also: "[I]f he [a sinning brother] refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector" (Mt 18:17). Paul warned similarly: "As for a man who is factious, after admonishing him once or twice, have nothing more to do with him, knowing that such a person is perverted and sinful; he is self-condemned" (Ti 3:10-11).
Lionel: This is the New Theology which accomodates invisible baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance, as being visible exceptions to the dogma EENS.
____________________________________

Having said all this, we must recognize that this doctrine is not as far reaching as some imagine it to be. People will sometimes ask, "Does this means non-Catholics are going to hell?" Not necessarily.
Lionel: All are on the way to Hell according to the dogma EENS and Vatican Council II (AG 7), unless they enter the Church with 'faith and bapism'.
___________________________________Invincibly Ignorant

The Church recognizes that God does not condemn those who are innocently ignorant of the truth about his offer of salvation. Regarding the doctrine in question, the Catechism of the Catholic Church (quoting Vatican II document Lumen Gentium, 16) states:
This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church: Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those too may achieve eternal salvation. (CCC 847)
Lionel: Those who are in invincible ignorance and are saved are not known to us on earth, in personal cases.They do not exist in our reality.So they were never an exception or relevant to the dogma EENS. It is mentioned here in LG 16 because of the objective error in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949.This is the effect of the new irrational theology. It is a new doctrine created with an irrational theology.
Hypothetical cases of invincible ignorance cannot be exceptions to EENS. This is a false reasoning. It is false philosophy.
_____________________________________
Vatican II document Gaudium Et Spesteaches similarly on the possibility of salvation:

All this holds true not only for Christians, but for all men of good will in whose hearts grace works in an unseen way. For, since Christ died for all men, and since the ultimate vocation of man is in fact one, and divine, we ought to believe that the Holy Spirit in a manner known only to God offers to every man the possibility of being associated with this paschal mystery. (22)
This teaching is consistent with Jesus’ own teaching about those who innocently reject him: "If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not have sin" (Jn 15:22).
Lionel: Again these are theoretical and speculative cases and so they cannot be relevant to the dogma EENS.
Hypothetical cases of invincible ignorance, the possibility of salvation for unknown people etc, cannot be exceptions to the dogma EENS.This was magisterial heresy. It was a doctrinal error.
___________________________________

But once a person comes to know the truth, he must embrace it or he will be culpable of rejecting it. We see this in Jesus’ words to the Pharisees: "If you were blind, you would have no guilt; but now that you say, ‘We see,’ your guilt remains" (Jn 9:41). Paul taught likewise concerning the Gentiles:
When Gentiles who have not the law do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus. (Rom 2:14-16)
Notice Paul’s carefully chosen words: "their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them." Paul did not say that those who are innocently ignorant of the truth will be saved; he simply keeps open the possibility of it.
Lionel: A possibility cannot be an exception to the dogma EENS. This was the false reasoning of the Holy Office cardinals in Rome in 1949.
__________________________________

Similarly, he wrote: "[I]s God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, since God is one; and he will justify the circumcised on the ground of their faith and the uncircumcised through their faith" (Rom 3:29-30).
Necessary for Salvation

As we have seen, God introduced salvation to the world through his chosen people, the Jews. God’s revelation to the Jews found its fulfillment in Christ, the Messiah, who established the Catholic Church. The grace necessary for salvation continues to come from Christ, through his Church. Those who innocently do not know and embrace this might still attain salvation but those who knowingly and willingly choose to reject it, reject salvation on God’s terms.
Lionel:Again there is nothing said in this passage which contradicts the strict interpretation of the dogma EENS.
______________________________________

The Catechism (once again quoting Lumen Gentium) summarizes all this as follows:

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it. (CCC 846)
Lionel:  'Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it'.This is a superflous passage which is based on Cushingite theology.-Lionel Andrades


 https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/what-no-salvation-outside-the-church-means

I casi invisibili non sono visibili. Quindi non ci sono eccezioni al dogma EENS menzionato nel decreto sull'ecumenismo. Il Concilio Vaticano II non contraddice il dogma EENS per me.

 

Unitatis redintegratio - il decreto del Vaticano II sull'ecumenismo


 
Redatto da
Fra. Michele Dimond, O.S.B.
Fra. Pietro Dimond, O.S.B.
 
 
Rosario Benedettino
 
Continuando si giunge alla parte terza del decreto sull'ecumenismo del Vaticano II.
Documento del Vaticano II, Unitatis redintegratio (3): "Inoltre, alcuni, forse anche quasi tutti, delle dotazioni e degli elementi significativi cui assieme costruiscono e danno vita alla Chiesa stessa possono esistere al di fuori dei confini visibili della Chiesa Cattolica: la parola di Dio; la vita di grazia; la Fede, la speranza e la carità, assieme ad altri doni interiori dello Spirito Santo e persino elementi visibili." [15]
 
Lionel:Questa affermazione deriva dalla New Theology, la teologia irrazionale sostenuta da Rahner e Ratzinger. Si presume che i casi ipotetici siano espliciti. Allora afferma che questi casi oggettivi sono eccezioni al dogma extra ecclesiam nullas salus (EENS).

  'elementi significativi cui assieme costruiscono e danno vita alla Chiesa stessa possono esistere al di fuori dei confini visibili della Chiesa Cattolica...'
Lionel: Come pòssibilita, O.K.Theoreticamente O.K. Conosciuto solo a Dio. O.K .Ma come un caso oggettivo e noto, No.
Quindi, quando non ci sono casi oggettivi come tali, non sono eccezioni al dogma EENS. Peter e Michael hanno commesso un errore.
________________________________

Si scopre dell'altra eresia nella parte terza del decreto sull'ecumenismo. Esso asserisce la bugia per la quale la vita di grazia, la grazia santificante o la giustificazione, esista ed esiste al di fuori dei confini visibili della Chiesa Cattolica. Ciò è direttamente contrario al solenne insegnamento di Papa Bonifacio VIII presente nella bolla Papale Unam Sanctam. 
Papa Bonifacio VIII, Unam Sanctam, 18/11/1302: "Con la Fede esortanteCi Noi siamo costretti a credere ed a sostenere l'Una, Santa, Chiesa Cattolica ed Apostolica, credendo fermamente e confessando semplicemente questa Chiesa fuori dalla quale vi è nessuna salvezza né remissione di peccato, la Sposa nel Cantico proclamante: 'Una è la mia colomba, quella perfetta.'." [16]
Lionel:  .'..questa Chiesa fuori dalla quale vi è nessuna salvezza né remissione di peccato' SI.
E non conosciamo nessuno nel 2017 che è salvato fuori della Chiesa.
______________________________
 
Il Vaticano II contraddisse il dogma per il quale vi è nessuna remissione del peccato al di fuori della Chiesa Cattolica, avendo asserito la blasfemia donde si possieda e si possiede la vita di grazia, includente la remissione dei peccati, al di fuori della Chiesa Cattolica.
Lionel:Il Concilio Vaticano II non ha contraddetto il dogma. L'interpretazione con la premessa irrazionale (casi invisibili sono visibili e sono eccezioni oggettive per EENS) ha creato la rottura con il dogma EENS.
Per me, Lionel, i casi invisibili non sono visibili. Quindi non ci sono eccezioni al dogma EENS menzionato nel decreto sull'ecumenismo. Il Concilio Vaticano II non contraddice il dogma EENS per me.
_____________________________
 
 Vi è, comunque sia, ancor più eresia presente nel decreto sull'ecumenismo. Il Vaticano II asserì candidamente la cattiveria per la quale tali comunità da esso descritte sono mezzi di salvezza.
Documento del Vaticano II, Unitatis redintegratio (3): "Ne consegue che queste chiese e queste comunità separate come tali, malgrado da noi reputate deficienti sotto tali aspetti, sono state per nessun mezzo private del significato e dell'importanza del mistero della salvezza. Poiché lo Spirito del Cristo non si è limitato dall'utilizzarle come mezzo di salvezza, la cui efficacia proviene da quella pienezza di grazia e di verità affidate alla Chiesa Cattolica." [17]
Lionel:  'Poiché lo Spirito del Cristo non si è limitato dall'utilizzarle come mezzo di salvezza', come una possibilità conosciuto solo Dio, come un caso ipotetico.Va bene! UR 3 non dice che questi casi sono conosciuti.Non c'e problema.
Ma per Peter e Michael Dimond UR 3 referisce a case visibili.Questo e suoi inferenza.Così diventano eccezioni al dogma EENS.
Quindi la colpa è lì con la loro interpretazione.
Io chiamo loro interpretazione Cushingismo (casi invisibili sono visibili) e il mio Feeneyismo (casi invisibili sono invisibili solo).
-Lionel Andrades
________________________________

Michael e Peter Dimond accettano questa Nuova Teologia e per loro il Concilio Vaticano II è una rottura con la Tradizione. Quindi hanno commesso un errore


2 delle dichiarazioni più antiche sul "Battesimo" di sangue


Redatto da
Fra. Pietro Dimond, O.S.B.

San Cipriano.
San Cipriano.
Fra i pochi padri Ecclesiastici citabili a favore del "Battesimo" di sangue come possibile sostituto del Santo Battesimo effettivo 2 delle più antiche dichiarazioni sostenenti tale idea provengono da San Cipriano e da Tertulliano.
San Cipriano, A Giubaiano, 254 DC: "I catecumeni soffrenti il martirio prima che essi possano ricevere il Battesimo con acqua non sono privati del Sacramento del Battesimo. Piuttosto, essi sono battezzati con il più glorioso e più grande battesimo di sangue… " [165]
Che si esamini il passaggio. Nell'insegnare il "Battesimo" di sangue notisi come San Cipriano abbia commesso e commise un errore significativo nella medesima frase. Egli affermò: "I catecumeni soffrenti il martirio prima che essi possano ricevere il Battesimo non sono privati del Sacramento del Battesimo.". Ciò è completamente errato, anche dal punto di vista dei difensori del "Battesimo" di sangue o di desiderio. Tutti i difensori del "Battesimo" di sangue e di desiderio ammettono subito l'effettività per la quale nessuno di essi è un Sacramento, poiché nessuno di essi conferisce il carattere indelebile del Sacramento del Santo Battesimo. Sicché, anche i difensori più atavici del "Battesimo" di sangue ammetterebbero la realtà donde la dichiarazione di San Cipriano è errata. Pertanto, nell'esatta frase in cui San Cipriano insegna l'errore del "Battesimo" di sangue egli commette un errore significativo nello spiegarlo: egli lo appella Sacramento del Santo Battesimo. Quale altra prova è necessaria onde dimostrare ai liberali che l'insegnamento dei padri Ecclesiastici individuali non è infallibile, che esso non rappresenta la Sacra Tradizione Universale e che esso sarebbe eziandio pericoloso ove sostenuto ostinatamente? Perché citano essi tali passaggi erronei onde tentare di fingere di insegnare ai fedeli quando essi sono nemmeno in accordo con i passaggi medesimi?
Lionel:
Nessuno di loro ha affermato che il battesimo del desiderio si riferisce a un caso personalmente noto. Come possono casi invisibili nella nostra realtà essere eccezioni al dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus?
____________________________
 
Inoltre, gli errori di San Cipriano in tale esatto documento, indirizzato a Giubaiano, non terminano con quello esaminato. Nel medesimo documento San Cipriano insegna l'errore per il quale gli eretici non possono amministrare validamente il Santo Battesimo. 
San Cipriano, A Giubaiano, 254 DC: "… con riguardo a ciò che io pensi circa la tematica del Battesimo degli eretici… Questo Battesimo noi non possiamo riconoscerlo come valido… " [166]
Anche ciò è completamente errato, dacché il Concilio di Trento definì che gli eretici, attesoché essi osservino la corretta materia e forma, conferiscono il Santo Battesimo validamente. Invece, San Cipriano sosteneva che l'errore per cui gli eretici non possono conferire un valido Santo Battesimo provenisse dalla Sacra Tradizione Apostolica. Tale falsa idea fu opposta dall'allora Papa Santo Stefano, dipoi condannata dalla Chiesa Cattolica. Tanto perciocché si dichiara che la lettera di San Cipriano a Giubaiano sia una sicura rappresentazione della Sacra Tradizione Apostolica. Difatti, San Cipriano e 30 altri vescovi dichiararono quanto segue in un concilio regionale del 254 DC:
"Noi… giudicandolo e sostenendolo come certo che nessuno di improprio [ossia, al di fuori della Chiesa Cattolica] sia capace di essere battezzato… ". [167]
Ciò dimostra ancora il punto: Gesù Cristo donò l'infallibilità solamente a San Pietro ed ai suoi successori, i Papi.
Luca 22:31-32: "Disse di più il Signore: Simone, Simone, ecco che Satana va in cerca di voi per vagliarvi come si fa del grano: Ma io ho pregato per te, affinché la tua fede non venga meno: e tu una volta ravveduto conferma i tuoi fratelli."
Gesù Cristo non donò la Fede Universale infallibile ai vescovi, ai teologi od ai padri della Chiesa Cattolica, Egli la donò solamente a San Pietro ed ai di lui successori ove parlanti dalla Sedia di San Pietro od ove proponenti una dottrina ai fedeli da essere creduta come Divinamente rivelata.
Papa Pio IX, Concilio Vaticano I, 1870, ex-cathedra: "Dunque, questo regalo di verità e di Fede infallibile fu Divinamente conferito a Pietro ed ai suoi successori in questa sedia… " [168]
Un altro padre Ecclesiastico frequentemente citato a favore del "Battesimo" di sangue è Tertulliano. La sua dichiarazione è la dichiarazione registrata più antica insegnante il "Battesimo" di desiderio.
Tertulliano, Sul Santo Battesimo, 203 DC: "Se venissero lavati in acqua essi dovrebbero necessariamente venire lavati dal sangue. Questo è il battesimo che rimpiazza quello della fontana quando esso non è ancora stato ricevuto e lo ristora quando esso è stato perduto." [169]
Eppure, nella stessa opera in cui Tertulliano esprime la sua opinione a favore del "Battesimo" di sangue anch'egli commette un errore significativo e differente. Egli proclama che gli infanti non vanno battezzati sinché essi siano cresciuti.
Tertulliano, Sul Santo Battesimo, 203 DC: "A seconda della circostanza, disposizione e persino età della persona individuale potrebbe essere meglio ritardare il Battesimo e specialmente nel caso dei bimbi… Che essi giungano, dunque, mentre crescono… " [170]
Ciò contraddice la Sacra Tradizione Cattolica universale, ricevuta dagli Apostoli, ed il susseguente infallibile insegnamento dei Papi, donde gli infanti debbono essere battezzati il prima possibile.
Papa Eugenio IV, Concilio di Firenze, ex-cathedra: "Circa i bambini… il Santo Battesimo non andrebbe differito… " [171]
 Lionel:
Il battesimo del desiderio non è un'eccezione al dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus poiché è un caso invisibile. Le persone fisicamente invisibili non possono essere eccezioni a tutti coloro che hanno bisogno di entrare nella Chiesa per la salvezza.
_______________________________
Nondimeno, oltre a ciò, nella medesima opera Sul Santo Battesimo, Tertulliano afferma effettivamente l'universale insegnamento della Sacra Tradizione sull'assoluta necessità del Santo Battesimo di acqua per la salvazione, contrario all'idea del "Battesimo" di sangue.
Tertulliano, Sul Santo Battesimo, 203 DC: "… è infatti prescritto che nessuno può ottenere la salvezza senza il Battesimo, specialmente in vista di quella dichiarazione del Signore, Il Quale disse: 'A meno che un uomo sia rinato di acqua egli non avrà la vita, Giovanni 3:5, … '." [172]
Perciò, coloro pensanti che il "Battesimo" di sangue sia un insegnamento della Chiesa Cattolica semplicemente perciocché tale errore fu espresso da una serie di padri Ecclesiastici si trovano in errore, così come molti ed altri padri Ecclesiastici sostenevano l'inesattezza per la quale gli infanti non battezzati soffrono le pene dell'Inferno e per cui gli eretici non possono battezzare validamente. La teoria del "Battesimo" di sangue non è stata sostenuta universalmente o costantemente nella Sacra Tradizione Cattolica ed essa è stata giammai insegnata o menzionata da alcun Papa, da alcun concilio od in alcuna enciclica Papale.
Lionel:
C'è stato un errore oggettivo. E un errore di  fatto nella Lettera del Santo Ufficio del 1949 a Arcivescovo di Boston. Si presume che casi invisibili del battesimo del desiderio ecc. Erano eccezioni visibili  per il dogma fuori della Chiesa non c'e salvezza.Ma come e visibili? Dove e questi casi nel 2017?
Tutti  hanno bisogno di entrare nella Chiesa per la salvezza. La Lettera erroneamente supponeva che c'era la salvezza nota al di fuori della Chiesa.
Questo è diventato la Nuova Teologia che è stata accettata nel Concilio Vaticano II anche se è irrazionale.
Michael e Peter Dimond accettano questa Nuova Teologia e per loro il Concilio Vaticano II è una rottura con la Tradizione. Quindi hanno commesso un errore.-Lionel Andrades

http://vaticanocattolico.com/san-cipriano-battesimo-di-sangue/#.WUk5LyaQzcs









 
 
 

Tobacco Brand Manager Now Benedictine Nun

 

On May 6th Sr Maria Fides (Nicoletta) Falzoni made her solemn vows in the Benedictine abbey of Isola di San Giulio, Italy. She visited Medjugorje in August 2011 and joined the monastery a year later. Sr Maria Fides graduated in 2002 in business economics and worked as a brand manager for a tobacco multinational company.

The abbess and founder of the monastery, Mother Anna Maria Cànopi (86), wrote the text of the Way of the Cross, which John Paul II used at the Colosseum in 1993.
 
 

Church Militant Visits St.Therese Academy:

CHURCH MILITANT VISITS ST. THERESE ACADEMY

NEWS: US NEWS



By Bradley Eli, M.Div., Ma.Th.  •  ChurchMilitant.com  •  June 19, 2017    

Terri Raciti: "Catholic education is a mission; it's not a business"

CHESTER, N.Y. (ChurchMilitant.com) - Saint Therese Academy, a small Catholic school in upstate New York invited Church Militant to attend their graduation ceremony Wednesday.
Michael Voris and crew had the honor of getting to know faculty and some 40 students, who attend this "Little Flower" located in the town of Chester. Classical education is presented to all students from kindergarten through grade 12.
Headmistress Terri Raciti told Church Militant that the Faith comes first at their school. "Passing on the Faith is the most important thing we can do. It addresses that you're not alone. It reinforces that we all have a mission, that we're all here to be better people and to help each other get to Heaven," she said.
Raciti shared the grassroots origin of the school with Mr. Voris. "We started as just a homeschool support group," she related. "And we decided to do the classical education, because I feel that is the true way. Eventually we transitioned into a full-time school, and now we're here in Chester."
What makes this place unique from secular schools, besides the Catholic faith, is their classical education program. "The curriculum is strictly classical, meaning no Common Core, no appeal to modern techniques of the education establishment that have proved themselves massive failures," said Raciti. "Here, there is actual reading and arithmetic and writing and most importantly, the Faith being interwoven into every aspect of the curriculum."
The schools offers the full gamut of standard subjects from math, science, English and history; but students aren't taught merely what to think but how to think said Raciti. "This way of teaching was how people used to be educated," said Raciti. "It was the way we were taught; it was the way our founding fathers were taught. It was the way our greatest thinkers were taught — St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Augustine."
Most importantly, however, the Catholic faith is imparted to students here with the goal of getting them and their loved ones to Heaven. All of the subjects are related to and integrated with the Catholic faith. Raciti says going back to this classical norm is the future of Catholic education:
I fully believe that Catholic education is a mission; it's not a business, as a beautiful nun once said. We lost sight of the obligation to raise our children not only in the Catholic faith but to educate them Catholic. I don't understand why the schools would adopt a standardized curriculum when we have so much beauty right before us.https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/church-militant-visits-st.-therese-academy

Bradley Eli, M.Div., Ma.Th.

Bradley Eli, M.Div., Ma.Th. is a staff writer for ChurchMilitant.com.

Follow Bradley on Twitter: @BradleyLEli