Friday, March 18, 2016

Can the SSPX and the Franciscans of the Immaculate interpret Lumen Gentium 16 as invisible and hypothetical and not objective, seen in the flesh I keep asking ? :Pope Benedict's theology a rip off

Have you wondered why did Pope Benedict  have to surprisingly come out with this statement on extra ecclesiam nulla salus (EENS) in the interview with Avvenire.His rejection of the dogma because he can allegedly see or know exceptions in Heaven to all needing to convert into the Church,  is clear.He implies that there are physically visible cases of non Catholics who are in Heaven without the baptism of water. So there is salvation outside the Church, which he has personally seen in Heaven or some else he believes has seen.Since there is visible and known salvation outside the Church,for him the dogma has developed. This means he is not going to say all Jews, Muslims and Christians in 2016 need to formally convert into the Church to avoid Hell.He will lament over the loss of the dogma and the faith. But he will accept that the ordinary magisterium of Vatican Council II was sufficient to set aside a thrice defined dogma and that too with an irrationality, i.e being able to see people in Heaven who are there without 'faith and baptism'.
He gave the impression as if he was very sorry that the dogma has been rejected but  did not say that he had rejected the dogma with this fantasy theology of knowing people who will be saved or have been saved without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church.
So the bottom line is that he is not going to proclaim the dogma and neither will be allow you to do so.
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His statement comes after the Vatican Press Office was forced to announce a Document on relations with the Jews which they said was not magisterial.It said Jews did not need to convert. It was said directly based on the military and political strength of Israel. Pope Benedict said the same thing in the interview with Avvenire but did so theologically.
What is interesting about Pope Benedict's placating interview was not that he said that there was a development of doctrine, this was being said by the liberals and the Masons for a long time.It was interesting to note that there was a complete  black out on the issue of extra ecclesiam nulla salus and Vatican Council II being interpreted with the Feeneyite theology.
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He did not touch this subject.Even though there are a few thousands posts on this issue on the Internet he avoided it.Can the SSPX and the Franciscans of the Immaculate interpret Vatican Council II and the dogma EENS with the Feeneyite theology it was being asked of the CDF/Ecclesia Dei. Then comes this interview.But there is no mention of the alternative the SSPX and all Catholic religious communities and organizations have.They can interpret Vatican Council II in harmony with the strict interpretation on exclusive salvation in only the Catholic Church.
He did not answer the questions I put to Archbishop Guido Pozzo after his recent statement on the SSPX. Nor did he answer the questions I put to Bishop Athanasius Schneider after his recent interview with Rorate Caeili.They both did not want to say anything on this issue.There was no denial or clarification. May be they asked Pope Benedict for help.And no help is forthcoming.
Can the SSPX and the Franciscans of the Immaculate interpret Vatican Council II with Lumen Gentium 16 referring to invisible and hypothetical cases and not objective cases seen in the flesh I keep asking ? Neither the CDF, the traditionalists or the sedevacantists are willing to answer this question. The pope too has avoided it.
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We humans cannot see or know someone saved in invincible ignorance and who did not know about Jesus and the Church (LG 14).  So LG 14 is not a new doctrine. It does not contradict traditional EENS.It does not contradict the teaching on all unbaptised persons, needing to convert into the Church to avoid Hell. There was no comment from Pope Benedict on Lumen Gentium 14.
For Pope Benedict and Cardinal Muller LG 14 could contradict the traditional teaching on all the un-baptised needing the baptism of water for salvation. Since for them LG 14 would refer to explicit cases, seen in the flesh. So they are  exceptions to the dogma they become examples of salvation outside the Church.But are they really explicit? 
There are quote a large number of reports on the Internet only on this point.
Pope Benedict has avoided this issue.
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Instead he promoted his new theology which is based on an irrationality ( that of being able to see people in Heaven). He supports a theology of religious pluralism since he has not affirmed traditional EENS in the interview and believes there is salvation outside the Church. This is the basis for his 'development of the dogma'.With the new theology, he says all who are saved are saved through Jesus and the Church (CCC 846).

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This is his support for Rahner's Anonymous Christian theory.It is based on known salvation outside the Church.Redemptoris Missio and Dominus Iesus have been water down with the Cushing theology. They are not Feeneyite.There are Feeneyite statements in them but then he has accomodated also  the Cushingite error.
In spite of these contradictions the interview has been welcomed by many traditionalists.It was their way of saying, "See, Pope Benedict  also agrees with us on Vatican Council II".The traditionalists don't know that the theology he presented was a rip off.Vatican Council II is traditional and Feeneyite without the seeing people in Heaven theory.
He did not touch the real issue which would expose lies, corruption and politics in the name of theology over the last 70 years or more.
-Lionel Andrades

CDF can see 'the writing on the wall',thousands of Internet posts say the dogma EENS and Vatican Council II can be interpreted according to the old missionaries: Pope Benedict theologically contradicts them

POPE EMERITUS BENEDICT XVI: THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY FOR SALVATION


by Bradley Eli, M.Div., MA.Th.  •  ChurchMilitant.com  •  March 17, 2016    

The last 50 years have caused a great crisis of faith

VATICAN (ChurchMilitant.com) - Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI is saying belief that all men are saved has crippled missionary efforts and caused many Christians to leave the Faith.
An interview of the former Pope, conducted last year, is being published today in L'Osservatore Romano. In it the former pontiff is reaffirming the dogma that there's only one true Church outside of which there is no salvation.
Lionel: I would think the CDF can see 'the writing on the wall'. There are thousands of reports on the Internet which say the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and Vatican Council II can both be interpreted by assuming hypothetical cases are not explicit and the conclusion is traditional.
With this back ground the CDF could have called upon Pope Benedict to help.Instead of speaking the truth, seeing the reality all over the Internet which has been there for quite a few years, the pope sadly has decided to stick to the old irrationality which is the basis of the new theology.
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Discounting false churches that are founded on "assembly of men who have some ideas in common," Pope Benedict says they cannot be "the guarantor of eternal life."
Lionel: Yet his theology says otherwise.All who are saved are saved through Jesus and the Church. He is implying there is salvation outside the Church. There are people saved in invincible ignorance or the baptism of desire, without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church.This is the theology of Cushingism. This is Pope Benedict's theology even though there are no known exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. Humanly speaking we cannot know of any exception i.e people in Heaven without the baptism of water.
So it was on this false speculation (seeing people in Heaven )  that the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 was issued. Then this irrational reasoning was transferred to Vatican Council II.
We are not limited to this reasoning. All non-hypothetical cases for Pope Benedict mentioned in Vatican Council (LG 16 etc) are just hypothetical for me. So there is nothing in the Council to contradict extra ecclesiam nulla salus as it was known to the missionaries.
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Contrasting self-created institutions with the Catholic Church, Benedict clarifies, "The Church is not self-made; She was created by God, and She is continuously formed by Him."
He refutes the modern notion that all men are saved, commenting that men of today have "the sense that God cannot let most of humanity be damned."
Lionel: Yet this is what Vatican Council II suggests if you do not use Pope Benedict's irrationality. God can let most of humanity be damned.This was the teaching for centuries. It is there in Vatican Council II interpreted with Feeneyism.
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Pope Emeritus notes that starting in "the second half of the last century," mankind believed "God cannot let go to perdition all the unbaptized" or even let them go to a place of "purely natural happiness," which the Church calls Limbo.
Lionel: This was Pope Benedict's speculation since he believed there was salvation outside the Church.It was reasoned by the CDF that if one person could be saved outside the Church then why not all babies.
While the liberals say if one adult can be saved outside the Church then why not most adults.Bishop Barron says....This is all based on Pope Benedict's rejection of traditional Feeneyism as a theology.
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Benedict contrasts the zeal of "the great missionaries of the 16th century" who "were still convinced that those who are not baptized are forever lost" with the lackluster missionary efforts after the Second Vatican Council, when "that conviction was finally abandoned" by many.
Lionel: Yes "that conviction was finally abandoned" by many,since the Letter(1949)  suggested that a person could be saved in invincible ignorance and this case would be known to us human beings. So there was salvation outside the Church. Vatican Council II (LG 14) then repeats this error.It states those who know about  Jesus and the Church need to convert into the Church formally ( instead of all).In other words only those who are not in invincible ignorance need to convert. This is the ir-reasoning approved by Pope Benedict.
He could have simply said  LG 14 refers to a hypothetical case. We do not know in 2016 who is in invincible ignorance and will be saved or not saved. So LG 14 is irrelevant to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus as it was known to the Jesuit missionaries.
In 1949 the Jesuits along with the magisterium in Rome gave up traditional Feeneyism and accepted an innovation. Even Archbishop Lefebvre and the traditionalists approved it.Until today the pro-SSPX bloggers are not aware of the error and are actually praising Pope Benedict for this interview!!!
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The former pontiff affirms that the lost conviction that the Church is necessary for salvation causes "a deep double crisis."
Lionel: CMTV is unaware of the crisis caused by Pope Benedict by not telling Archbishop Lefebvre and the SSPX that they could interpret Vatican Council II with Feeneyism.He was the Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith and wanted Archbishop Lefebvre to accept Vatican Council II with Cushingism.
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"On the one hand this seems to remove any motivation for a future missionary commitment," he says. "Why should one try to convince the people to accept the Christian faith when they can be saved even without it?”
Lionel: If the CMTV staff interprets Vatican Council II and the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus without an irrationality, as does Pope Benedict, then there would be no known salvation outside the Church.We can invite people into the Church by telling them about the dogmatic teaching and that no one in 2016 knows of any exception. No one in the past could have also known of any case of salvation outside the Church.
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Benedict also notes that many Catholics were scandalized by this presumption into leaving the Church, explaining, "If there are those who can save themselves in other ways, it is not clear, in the final analysis, why the Christian himself is bound by the requirements of the Christian faith and its morals."
He then attacks the faulty attempts to "reconcile the universal necessity of the Christian faith with the opportunity to save oneself without it."
After dismissing Karl Rahner's mistaken notion that most men are saved as anonymous Christians,
Lionel: The new theology supports Fr.Rahner's mistaken notion on 'the anonymous Christian', since it says all who are saved are saved through Jesus and the Church. It implies there is salvation outside the Church and that a non Christian could be saved in his religion through Jesus and the Church. Even if this happened how is it relevant or an exception to the dogma on exclusive salvation? There is no known case of an anonymous Christian in Heaven.
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 Benedict turns to another popular theory. "Even less acceptable is the solution proposed by the pluralistic theories of religion, for which all religions, each in their own way, would be ways of salvation, and in this sense, in their effects must be considered equivalent."
Lionel: In one of the papers of the International Theological Commission of the Vatican,  Pope Benedict approved ' a theology of religions'. This was based on  there being known salvation outside the Church.
If we have to observe that Pope Benedict is not saying all non Catholics in 2016 need to convert into the Church to avoid Hell. He has only mentioned the dogma.
He says there is 'a development of the dogma'. So he is unable to affirm traditional extra ecclesiam nulla salus.Nor is he asking the SSPX or the Franciscans of the Immaculate to affirm the dogma like the early missionaries who did not use an irrationality to create a 'development'.
So today we cannot have Pope Benedict or Bishop Athanasius Schneider saying all Jews and Muslims with no exception need to formally convert into the Church, with faith and baptism, according to Vatican Council II(AG 7, LG 14) or, according to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. I can say it. Since I know that physically there are no exceptions visible to me. 
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In saying all this, Pope Emeritus Benedict is affirming the constant teaching that the Catholic Church is the only true Church and is absolutely necessary for salvation.
Lionel : On the contrary! He is denying it theologically for a discerning Catholic. He is denying the constant teaching that the Catholic Church is the only true Church and is absolutely necessary for salvation.
-Lionel Andrades


Pope Benedict uses irrational Cushingism as a theology to interpret Vatican Council II and extra ecclesiam nulla salus : he was unaware of the choice

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2016/03/pope-benedict-uses-irrational.html


Pope Francis, Pope Benedict and Cardinal Muller use an irrational theology to interpret Vatican Council II and so reject the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2016/03/pope-francis-pope-benedict-and-cardinal.html




http://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/pope-emeritus-benedict-xvi-the-catholic-church-is-absolutely-necessary-for



Pope Benedict uses irrational Cushingism as a theology to interpret Vatican Council II and extra ecclesiam nulla salus : he was unaware of the choice

From the blog The Eponymous Flower
http://eponymousflower.blogspot.it/2016/03/pope-benedict-breaks-silence-and.html#comment-form

Pope Benedict Breaks Silence and Affirms the Thrice Defined, Infallible Dogma, No Salvation Outside of the Catholic Church
Lionel:
False. He has denied it here. He has interpreted the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus (EENS) and Vatican Council II with Cushingism instead of Feeneyism.If he uses Feeneyism as a theology ( there are no known exceptions to EENs, past or present), then he would be affirming the thrice defined dogma.He would also be saying that Vatican Council II is in harmony with EENS and all Jews, Muslims, Protestants and Orthodox Christians need to formally convert into the Catholic Church for salvation. He would also be saying that there are no known cases in the present times, of non Catholics saved, who did not know about Jesus and the Church; who were in invincible ignorance, and did not convert (Lumen Gentium 14).So LG 14 is not a new doctrine it does not contradict the 'rigorist' interpretation of EENS.Neither does it contradict Vatican Council II (AG 7, LG 14) when it says 'all' need 'faith and baptism' for salvation.
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"Council Cast Church and Faithful into a Double Crisis" - Interview of Benedict XVI
Lionel : The contemporary magisterium did not use Feeneyism as a theology to intepret Vatican Council II and the dogma EENS. It has assumed hypothetical cases are objective exceptions to the need for all to be baptised with water for salvation.It accepted this error in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949.Based on this inter-office letter,  from one bishop to another, it discarded a dogma defined by three Church Councils. Fr.Karl Rahner S.J,. placed this Letter with an objective error in the Denzinger. Pope Benedict references it in the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
This was the crisis.
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(Rome) Pope Benedict XVI. has broken his silence that he undertook in connection with his unexpected resignation. Since 2013 he has lived in retirement in the convent, Mater Ecclesiae in the Vatican. Now has given Avvenire, the daily newspaper of the Italian Bishops' Conference a long interview, which was published in today's issue.
Lionel:
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus has become an issue. It is discovered that Vatican Council II interpreted with the theology of Feeneyism does not have ' a hermeneutic of rupture'.There has been no denial from the CDF or Ecclesia Dei.
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"Let us allow ourselves to be formed by Christ," is the title of a spiritual interview which addresses faith and theology. It does not involve daily affairs and church politics.
Lionel: He means faith and theology based on belief in Christ and excludes the necessity of membership in the Church for salvation.For Pope Benedict there are people in Heaven saved without the baptism of water in the Church. For him someone in the present times or in the past, actually saw people in Heaven without the baptism of water. He has not mentioned who this gifted person was who could see the dead, who are now in Heaven without 'faith and baptism'.This was the reasoning of the Letter (1949) and the Baltimore Catechism which he has approved unconditionally.In exchange he rejected the  Athanasius Creed ( outside the Church there is no salvation) and changed the Nicene Creed to 'I believe in three or more known baptisms without the baptism of water . We know for a fact that the baptism of desire cannot be seen or known in personal cases. It cannot be administered like the baptism of water. It does not exist in our reality.
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The interview was conducted by the Belgian Jesuit, Jacques Servais, director of the Casa Balthasar in Rome. Father Servais was under Cardinal Ratzinger from 1985-1990 an official in the CDF and from 1993-1996, the professor of dogmatic theology at the Institute of John Paul II. in Rome. He has published works on Cardinal Newman, Hans Urs von Balthasar and Adrienne von Speyr.

"Without being bound by salvation even the faith is baseless"

The central question of the interview is: "What is the faith and how does one come to believe?"
Emeritus Benedict XVI. spoke to the Church crisis in the interview:
"The missionaries of the 16th century were convinced that the unbaptized were lost forever. After the Council this conviction was abandoned. This resulted in a deep crisis. Without being bound to salvation the faith is baseless."
Lionel: The fault is not  there with Vatican Council II.For me Vatican Council II(AG 7, LG 14) says the unbaptised are lost forever. Since they will die without 'faith and baptism'.The majority of people are oriented to Hell since they die without Catholic Faith. This is Vatican Council II.
On the anthropological aspect of man, technology and love:
"People expect in their hearts that the Good Samaritan comes to their aid. In the hardness of the technological world in which feelings count for nothing, the expectation increases of a saving love that is unselfishly bestowed."
For increasing importance of charity:
"It is a sign of the times that the idea of ​​mercy coming from Sister Faustina becomes ever more central and more dominant."
Lionel: Sister Faustina Kowalski held the strict interpretation of the dogma EENs. Jesus teaches the  traditional interpretation of the dogma EENS. It is there  in the Diary of St.Faustina Kowalski.She prayed that non Catholic Christians  be saved from the fires of Hell. This was Jesus asking her to pray for heretics ( Protestants) and schismatics ( Orthodox Christians).
God's Mercy she says is available now,while we  live. After we die all will have to face  God's Justice.God's Mercy includes the  opportunity for non Catholics to formally convert into the  Church before they die. There are no known exceptions.
Father Servais asked Benedict XVI. about the justification dispute of Martin Luther and the struggle of St. Francis de Sales, who had followed in the wake of the Apostle Paul for the pastoral care of as many "infidels" as possible against the "terrible fate being eternally lost." Benedict XVI. proceeds in his reply in detail on the "development of this dogma" Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, because since the beginning of modern times, the historical perspectives with respect to the Middle Ages had changed "radically".
Lionel: There is a 'development' based on the use of an irrational inference.Hypothetical cases (LG 16, LG 8, UR 3, NA 2 etc) are interpreted as being objectively seen and known in the present times. This is the false premise.Then since it is inferred that these cases are physically seen and known, who have been saved without the baptism of water,so all do not need to enter the Church.It is wrongly concluded that not every one needs to formally enter the Church; not every one needs to by formally baptised with  water.
This is the irrational reasoning at the basis of the alleged 'development'.
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By giving the up the Church's necessity for salvation, the Council sparked a "double crisis"










"Double crisis" of Church and Faith

Thus, with the fact that the Second Vatican Council has "definitely" abandoned the belief that there is no salvation for unbaptized, the Church and the faith had fallen into a "double crisis".
Lionel:  The Second Vatican Council II when interpreted with Feeneyism ( no known exceptions to the dogma EENS in 2016, no visible cases of the baptism of desire without the baptism of water) supports the old teaching which says there is no salvation for the unbaptised. Any one can confirm this. Check it out. Look at LG 16 ( being saved in invincible ignorance) and see it as  an invisible case.Then ask yourself how can a possibility, what is theoretical and hypothetical for us humans, be a concrete exception in 2016, to all needing to formally and physically enter the Church with the baptism of water?
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"On the one hand it seems to withdraw any motivation a future missionary commitment. Why convince people of accepting the Christian faith, even if they can be saved without it?
Lionel: There is no known salvation outside the Church. No one in the past could have physically seen someone in Heaven without the baptism of water in the Catholic Church.
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But for Christians, the question on the necessity of faith and manner of life was uncertain and problematic. If there are those who can be saved in other ways, it is ultimately not evident why the Christian should be linked to the need of the Christian faith and its morals. But if the faith and salvation are not dependent on each other, the faith is also groundless.
Lionel: There was no known salvation outside the Church in Boston in 1949. So there was no known exception to the dogma EENS as it was interpreted traditionally by Fr.Leonard Feeney and the St.Benedict Center.
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Recently, various attempts have been made ​​to bring to reconciliation the universal need of the Christian faith with the opportunity to save oneself without them."

Rahner's "anonymous Christian" and the "superficiality" of pluralistic theories of religion are not solutions

Lionel: However Pope Benedict XVI has accepted pluralistic theories of religion based on the theology of Cushingism ( there is known salvation outside the Church).He also approved it one paper of the International Theological Commission, ' a theology of religions'.
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Benedict XVI. then addresses two of these "attempts", including the thesis of Karl Rahner's "anonymous Christian", in the being of Christ is synonymous with humanity. "It is true that this hypothesis is intriguing," but it excludes "the drama of change and renewal, which is central for Christianity."
Lionel : Pope Benedict theologically  approved Rahner's 'anonymous Christian', with the new theology. He says all who are saved are saved through Jesus and the Church. He means a non Catholic can be saved in his religion and he would be saved by Jesus.This can be seen in the Catechism of the Catholic Church (846).
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"Even less acceptable is the solution proposed by the pluralistic religious theories for all religions, each in their own way, are ways of salvation and to be considered in this sense, in their effects, as equivalent. The religious criticism, the way it is practiced on the Old Testament and of the primordial church, is much more realistic, concrete and true in its examination of the various religions." The pluralistic religious theories are "superficial" and "is not appropriate to the size of the question."
Lionel: A theology of religious pluralism is heresy. It rejects the Nicene Creed in which we pray ' I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sins'. We do not know of any case of the baptism of desire or blood, without the baptism of water.This is all speculation.
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Finally, Benedict XVI names a third solution proposed, that of Henri de Lubac, "and some other theologians" who had placed their emphasis on the standing substitute that vicarious substitution.
Lionel :These theologians are examples of modern day heresy. This had been accepted by Pope Benedict.It became 'magisterial heresy'.
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So that it may be that "the problem is not solved completely." But it would involve a "material intuition", where it is total but "clear", "that we must think about the whole issue."
Lionel: 'Material intuition'? One has to have the insight into irrational Cushingism and traditional Feeneyism and then all is clear.
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-Lionel Andrades

Pope Francis, Pope Benedict and Cardinal Muller use an irrational theology to interpret Vatican Council II and so reject the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2016/03/pope-francis-pope-benedict-and-cardinal.html