Sunday, August 31, 2014

And if you said that the Catechism of the Catholic Church and Vatican Council II are Feeneyite could you still be a priest in good standing?

My PhotoFr.Martin Fox:
Your argument isn't with me, but Saint Thomas Aquinas, whose writing I have quoted several times in this thread, and which it's crystal clear you really don't comprehend. I really have nothing better to offer than his words. You are welcome to have the last word, as I will offer nothing more on this.

If you said that St.Thomas Aquinas contradicts the Catechism of the Catholic Church's 'God is not limited to the Sacraments' wouldn't it be a threat to your career.
And if you said that the Catechism of the Catholic Church and Vatican Council II are Feeneyite could you still be a priest in good standing?
And if you were rational and said that you cannot see with the naked eye any exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, would they allow you to offer Holy Mass.
Speaking the truth,proclaiming the Truth has consequences.
It's easier for me as a layman.
Thanks for talking about it,at least.I understand your motives are good.
-Lionel Andrades

This is a non traditional ( opposed to Aquinas and Augustine),irrational and heretical ( contradicting the Nicene Creed and the dogma on salvation) statement.

The Catechism and Vatican Council II are Feeneyite if you avoid the false premise

It is common knowledge that we cannot see the dead who are in Heaven. CCC 1257-1260 infers that we can!



Maria Divine Mercy in sync with Bishop Galantino

Mother of Salvation: Soon you will be asked to give out a substitute for the Holy Eucharist, which will not be the Body of my Son

My child, I stand before my Son, at this time, and fall on my face at His Feet in great sorrow. Just as I had to witness His Agony at the foot of His Cross, during His terrifying Crucifixion, I now have to endure His Pain once again.
My Son’s Crucifixion is taking place again as His Body, His Mystical Body, which is His Church on Earth, has to endure a scourging by His own. They, the enemies within His Church, will scourge His Body, tear It apart, mock Him cruelly and desecrate It, before they throw It aside. My Son’s Church is now to be scourged, during what will be the first stage of His Crucifixion on Earth in these times. They will take His Body – through the Holy Eucharist – and insult Him as well as degrade Him. Many signs will be seen of this, as every disrespectful and devious gesture will be made, in order to curse Him. When they have vilified His Most Holy Eucharist, they will then throw It away and soon It will be very difficult to receive It. This is just one of the many plans underway to wipe out my Son’s Presence in the Holy Mass.
Many will see these wicked gestures and know that they are insulting to my Son. Many will protest, but their voices will not be heard. To those poor priests, who will suffer because of this desecration, you must ask me, your Mother, to help you endure such pain. You must never ever tamper with the Holy Eucharist, for It is your only Food of Salvation. Without It, you will starve. It must always be made available to every single one of God’s children. You must never accept that any other kind of bread is the Food of Life.
Soon you will be asked to give out a substitute for the Holy Eucharist, which will not be the Body of my Son. You must remain true to the Gift of the Holy Eucharist even when you are told that It is no longer relevant – no longer acceptable in the new world religion.
Your Mother in Christ
Mother of Salvation

The danger to the Existence of the Holy Eucharist will be shown to you

My dearly beloved daughter, you now understand how much this Mission is detested by the evil one. You must, however, rise above the cruel obstacles placed before you to slow down My Work.
The danger to the Existence of the Holy Eucharist will be shown to you through the arrogance of those within My Church, whose plan to change the Truth has begun in earnest.
It does not matter that many amongst you sneer at My Mission to prepare your souls for the Great Day. In time you will know that it is indeed, I, Jesus Christ, Who comes to you in order to serve you.
I Am your Master and your Servant. You, My sacred servants, must remember your role and never forget it. As servants, you cannot be masters as well. For if you are a master, you cannot serve Me. Many of you within My Church have forgotten what you were taught. You have forgotten the Word of God.
My Promise is to provide you with the Food of Life – My Body and Blood – and yet, you will, once again, deny Me. You will do this by removing the Holy Eucharist from the Temple of God and you will replace It with a corpse. The substitute will be subtle and it will take a while before you can detect the evil action, which will be foisted upon you.
As My Body, through the Holy Eucharist, sustains you, the death of My Body, My Church, will bring death to the souls of those who discard Me.
The time for the abomination is very near. The time for choosing between My Path, or that of the false prophet, is almost upon you. Watch, now, as the Truth will be twisted by the imposter. See how he will exalt himself in My Shoes, but will refuse to walk the path of Truth as a servant of God.
Your Jesus
In a clear little volume dedicated to The Natural Law in The Doctrine of the Church (Consult Editrice, Rome, 2008), Cardinal Zenon Grocholewski, Prefect for the Congregation of Catholic Education, explained how the ordinary Magisterium, on the primary level of its infallible teaching, includes, alongside the deposit of the faith, whatever is connected to it, ergo, also the natural law. Therefore, the natural law which the Church is guardian of, enjoys infallibility. Not even the Pope, who exercises absolute authority inside the Church, can modify or render relative the Divine and Natural Law, which he has the duty to transmit, diffuse and defend. Those who are asking the Church to update Her morality i.e. putting cohabitating couples on a par with the family, are asking the Church to exercise an authority which She does not have.-Roberto de Mattei

Changes to be introduced in the Church, which will contradict the Word of God

My dearly beloved daughter, it is I, Jesus Christ, Who came in the flesh.
My Most Holy Word must now be heard by My sacred servants everywhere. All My followers must share these Messages with My sacred servants of all Christian denominations. It is vital that they are encouraged to hear My Word at this crucial time, before they are torn asunder and split into two camps.
The work of the deceiver has infiltrated My Church on every level. Very soon now, slowly but surely, you will see Holy Masses being reduced. You will see the removal of special prayers and some of the Sacraments, such as Confession, begin to diminish. I call on My sacred servants now to listen to Me and pray for discernment. It is I Who calls you now, so I can save your flock. It is I Who wants to open your hearts so you can plan for these end times, which will herald a brand new beginning for the world.
You will be asked to show allegiance to the false prophet very soon. See him for what he is and judge his works in order to see if they bear fruit. For the fruit that he and his slavish devotees will yield will be rotten to the core. One bite will destroy your allegiance to Me. Two or more bites will drive such a wedge between you and My Sacred Heart that you will find it almost impossible to enter My Father’s Kingdom.
Watch carefully now the changes you will see creeping in within your own ministry. Some of these adjustments will not seem to be a problem in the beginning. But as time moves on certain changes will be forced upon you and you will be made to swallow lies. The lies will come from Satan and will be dressed in sheep’s clothing.
For those pure of heart you will know instantly and will recognize the evil cunning in place, which is being designed to destroy My Church on Earth, from within its own corridors.
My Truth will cause gasps of indignity throughout the world when My priests will say surely this prophecy is a lie? The only lie that they will have to bear witness to will be the one they are forced to approve, which will be in direct opposition to My Sacred Scriptures given to mankind right from the start. Never allow yourselves to accept any other Truth other than that contained in the Holy Bible.
Many changes will be introduced, which will contradict the Word of My Eternal Father. These changes, My sacred servants, won’t be of divine origin and you must reject these untruths if you want to remain loyal to Me.
Wake up. Stand up to those lies you will have to face. Never accept them. My Eternal Father’s Word will never change. It can never be adjusted by mankind. Many of you will be so distraught that you will find yourselves isolated from your fellow sacred servants. Fear not, for there is only one side you can choose. That will be the side where I stand. There is no other side.
Your beloved Saviour
Jesus Christ

All the Fathers and Doctors of the Church spoke about this law, defining it at times as the scintilla animae, the spark which enlightens conscience. St.Thomas Aquinas is the one who studied and summarized the concept best, defining it as “the participation of the eternal law in rational creatures.” (Summa Theologiae, I-II, q. 91, a.2).
If the concept of the natural law is lost, we will be compelled to accept the theory of gender based on the denial of the very concept of human nature. Man is thought of as a purely material entity, modifiable at will, according to the needs and interests of the moment.
The natural law which comes down from God, is substituted by positive law imposed by pressures from political and mass-media groups. Instead of reflecting on the natural and Divine Law, laws and human behavior are adapting to the opinion of fluctuating and anti-Christian trends.
It is clear that on this issue, the discussion at the next Synod of Bishops will be very hot-Roberto de Mattei.

Many Popes have been prisoners in the Holy See, surrounded by Masonic groups

My dearly beloved daughter, to My churches through the world I say this:
Know that I will always be with you at your side, as long as you proclaim My Most Holy Word.
To My Catholic Church, even though you caused torment as a result of evil sin, know that I will never forsake you, although you have sinned. But know this.
Your faith in Me, is not as strong as it should be. You do not love Me, as you once did.
All the wealth you accumulated, put a distance between Me, your Christ and Saviour and God’s ordinary children.
You scaled such lofty heights, that I could not reach up to you and offer you My Hand to salvage you from the rot within your core.
You were taught the Truth by My Peter, upon whose Rock you were built. And what did you do?
You built thick stone walls around you.
This caused a lack of communication with those whom you needed to feed with My Body and Blood, so that their souls could be nourished.
The respect required of you in administering My Most Holy Eucharist, was lost, when you demeaned My Presence.
When Vatican II declared new rules, they were introduced, by those evil Masonic forces, from within your corridors.
They cunningly presented new ways to administer My Holy Eucharist, which are insulting to Me.
Your so-called tolerant teachings proclaimed a series of lies, including the refusal to acknowledge the power of Saint Michael the Archangel.
He is the protector of the Church against Satan. Those forces among you knew this. This is why you stopped all prayers, requesting his help, before Me at Mass.
Then you perpetrated the biggest untruth, that Hell was not to be feared. That it was just a metaphor. For this lie, accepted as the Truth by many of God’s children, has meant the loss of billions of souls.
How you offend Me. For those humble and sacred servants among you, I ask that you go back to My Teachings.
Never allow riches to accumulate amongst you and think that they are acceptable in My Eyes.
Riches, gold and power accumulated in My Name, will be your downfall. You cannot profit from My Holy Word.
You have suffered because of the way you have offended Me.
Never think that I Am blaming the many holy popes who have sat in the Seat of Peter. Their Mission has always been protected.
Many popes have been prisoners in the Holy See, surrounded by Masonic groups, who do not represent God.
They hate God and have spent fifty years spreading untruths, about the Mercy of God.
Their works have led to the collapse of the Catholic Church.
This was not an accident. It was deliberately and cunningly plotted in order to destroy the faith of the Church, to destroy the homage of ordinary Catholics, to the One True God.
For this, you will now be cast aside into the wilderness. After Pope Benedict, you will be led by Me, from the Heavens.
Oh how you have made Me weep.
I call on all of My sacred servants, who know the Truth, to stand up and follow Me, your Jesus, to spread the Truth of My Teachings in humble servitude. You must find the courage and the strength to rise from the ashes.
Above all, reject the lies, which will shortly be presented to you by the false prophet.
He will merge the Catholic Church with other churches, including pagan churches, to become one abomination, a one world church without a soul.
Your Jesus

Importance of Sacraments – Marriage and First Holy Communion
My dearly beloved daughter, watch now as the faith of My children begins to grow and blossom. While there is much darkness in the world the light of My followers becomes brighter by the day because of the Flame of the Holy Spirit, which has descended over the whole world.
Today, My daughter, I wish to remind all of My followers of the importance of prayer to ease suffering in the world. Your prayers are now helping to avert many global disasters foretold. Prayer is the most powerful mitigation and when said on behalf of others, they will be answered.
While I Am happy with those of strong faith; I Am still fearful for those who are adverse to My Divine Light, the Truth. Many people now wander around the world as if in a stupor. Nothing brings them peace. Nothing brings them joy. No amount of material comfort eases their pain. Their empty souls are lost. Please pray for them.
My daughter, please pray for My Vicar, Pope Benedict, for he is surrounded by masonic forces who are now making every effort to dethrone him, these evil forces have been infiltrating My Church since Vatican II and have diluted My Teachings. Many laws were passed which offend Me, especially the presentation of My Holy Eucharist by lay people. The lack of respect shown to Me and My Eternal Father, through new laws introduced to facilitate modern society has made Me cry with sadness.
The Most Holy Eucharist must be received on the tongue and not soiled by human hands. Yet this is precisely what My sacred servants have done. These laws were not passed by Me in Spirit. My sacred servants have been led down a path not in line with the Teachings of My apostles. Today My Sacraments are not taken very seriously, especially those who seek the Sacraments of Matrimony and the First Holy Communion.
The Vow of Matrimony is very serious, for remember it is a Sacrament and is made in the Presence of God the Father, yet for many it all about materialism and the exterior trappings. Many who receive the Sacrament of Matrimony do not acknowledge its importance thereafter. Many break their vows so easily. Why do they do this? Why pay lip service to this most holy union only to part soon afterwards? This is a mockery of one of the most important unions blessed by the Hand of My Eternal Father. Many people do not pay any heed of My Father’s Will that no man shall pull asunder such a union thereafter, yet many people divorce, which is a law not recognized by My Father. Divorce is an easy way to run from your responsibilities. All marriages are made in Heaven. No man can destroy a marriage without offending My Father.
First Holy Communion
Receiving My Body in the Sacrament of the Eucharist for the first time is another example as to how I Am mocked. So many parents pay no heed to the importance of their children receiving the Bread of Life. They are more concerned as to how well-dressed their children are, rather than the wonderful Gift they are receiving. This Gift will lead them to salvation. Yet the materialism, which surrounds the event, has nothing to do with their souls. For Me the saddest part is that these little children are not being told about Me. The Love I have for little children is all-encompassing. When they receive the Holy Eucharist, in the full knowledge as to what they are receiving, then their souls become pure. The more they receive Me in this way, the stronger will their faith be.
Remember, without the Sacraments, your faith becomes weak. After a time, if your soul is bereft of My special blessings, it becomes dormant. All faith in Me and My Eternal Father disappears in time with only a tiny flicker of recognition flaring up from time to time. Return to Me through the Sacraments. Show respect for the Sacraments in the way you are supposed to and you will truly feel My Presence again.
Remember, the Sacraments are there for a reason, for they are the nutrients you need for eternal life of the soul. Without them your soul will die.
I love you all. Please embrace Me properly, by respecting the Sacraments given to you as a Gift from God the Almighty Father.
Your loving Saviour
King of Mankind, Jesus Christ

Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate are misled by the line 'God is not limited to the Sacraments'

If the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate who offer the Novus Ordo Mass and the Traditional Latin Mass, interpret the Catechism and Vatican Council II as Feeneyites, then they can endorse Tradition and also the Council. Without the false premise they can have it both ways.It would not violate the Principle of Non Contradiction. They can affirm the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and also implicit for us baptism of desire, invisible for us being saved in invincible ignorance etc.
Presently,like you Fr.Martin, most of them interpret the Council and Catechism with the irratioinal premise (except for a few of them).So the Council comes across as a break with the past and then reject it.
They are misled by the line 'God is not limited to the Sacraments' as referring to real, visible exceptions.This is irrational.-Lionel Andrades

Upon a hypothetical case Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger cannot reject a de fide teaching which says God has bound salvation to the Sacraments

Fr.Martin Fox:
Thank you for stating your position.
So, when Augustine says (as reported by St Thomas Aquinas):
"some have received the invisible sanctification without visible sacraments, and to their profit; but though it is possible to have the visible sanctification, consisting in a visible sacrament, without the invisible sanctification, it will be to no profit."
You disagree with Augustine?
It's a yes or no question.
Your answer should be one word.
Yes. Or no.


Fr.Martin Fox says:
'some have received the invisible sanctification without visible sacraments, and to their profit; but though it is possible to have the visible sanctification, consisting in a visible sacrament, without the invisible sanctification, it will be to no profit."

'some have received the invisible sanctification without visible sacraments, and to their profit'.This is irrelevant to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the need for all to receive the baptism of water. Since we do not know and cannot know any such case in 2014.It is hypothetical.

Even if it is correct, as it is meaningful for you, what bearing does it have on all needing the baptism of water for salvation in 2014 and there are no exceptions?

So even if there was such a case one could not say 'God is not limited to the Sacraments' since this case would not be part of the reality of Cardinal Ratzinger.

Upon a hypothetical case he cannot reject a de fide teaching which says God has bound salvation to the Sacraments.
-Lionel Andrades

This is a non traditional ( opposed to Aquinas and Augustine),irrational and heretical ( contradicting the Nicene Creed and the dogma on salvation) statement.

Fr Martin Fox said...

One more try and then that's it.
Focus, focus focus....
You claimed Ratzinger made an error regarding one, particular statement:
"God is not limited to the sacraments."
I'm telling you that Aquinas said virtually the same thing. I quoted it above.
If you respond, respond by addressing this ONE AND ONLY ONE issue. Not "seeing the dead." Whatever the merits of that topic, I did not intend to ask about that, and at this moment, that is not my concern.
Please address how Ratzinger's quoted statement above can be wrong, but not Aquinas.
If you don't want to address that ONE AND ONLY topic, then there's no need to respond at all.


"God is not limited to the sacraments."
This implies that there is known salvation outside the Church and so ...God is not limited to the Sacraments.
It implies that the baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance (CCC 1258-1260) are visible in the flesh in 2014 for them to be exceptions to all needing the baptism of water for salvation.So God is not limited to the Sacraments.

This is false since we do not know any person in 2014 who is an exception to all needing the baptism of water.
It is false since no magisterial text before 1949 claims we know such persons in real life.
It is false since no magisterial text before the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 claims that there are known exceptions to extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
So how can it be said God is not limited to the sacraments when there is no New Revelation in the Catholic Church to contradict the thrice defined dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
It is wrong since it would contradict Vatican Council II (AG 7) and the Catechism itself (846,1257).
It contradicts St.Thomas Aquinas who says the baptism of water is always needed for salvation.He never claimed that there were known exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
This is a non traditional ( opposed to Aquinas and Augustine),irrational and heretical ( contradicting the Nicene Creed and the dogma on salvation) statement.
-Lionel Andrades