Wednesday, July 9, 2014

Dr.Taylor Marshall and the faculty at Fischer More College were using the right hand side column so Vatican was a break with Tradition

 
I have placed a comment on Dr.Taylor Marshall's blog. I hope he will answer the questions.
At the Fischer More College, where he was a professor,  they were  using the right hand side column in the interpretation of Vatican Council II.
 
 
Last Day to Join New Saint Thomas Institute! by
 
1.
What is the position of the St.Thomas Institute on Catholic Salvation Theology ? How would you respond to these TWO QUESTIONS ?


1) Do we personally know the dead now saved in invincible ignorance, a good conscience (LG 16) etc,can we see them, are they physically visible to us in 2014 ?
2) Since we do not know any of these cases, in real life, they are not visible for us, there are no known exceptions to the literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, or Ad Gentes 7 which states 'all' need 'faith and baptism' for salvation ?
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2.
Would you interpret Vatican Council II with the right hand side or left hand side column?
LEFT HAND SIDE COLUMN - RIGHT HAND SIDE COLUMNAll salvation referred to in Vatican Council II i.e saved in invincible ignorance (LG 16), imperfect communion with the Church (UR 3),seeds of the Word (AG 11), good and holy things in other religions (NA 2) etc are either:
implicit                      or            explicit for us.
hypothetical              or            known in reality.
invisible                     or           visible in the flesh.
dejure ( in principle)  or           defacto ( in fact ).
subjective                 or            objective
So one can choose from the left hand side or the right hand side column.
If the right hand side column is chosen then Vatican Council II contradicts the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, the Syllabus of Errors and Tradition in general on other religions and Christian communities and churches. There are known exceptions in 2014 to the dogma on exclusive salvation in the Cathlic Church. The dead- saved are visible.
If the left hand side column is chosen then Vatican Council II does not contradict extra ecclesiam nulla salus, nor Tradition on other religions and Christian communities and churches.
Most people interpret Vatican Council II with the right hand side values.
So the baptism of desire and being saved in invincible ignorance was never ever an exception to the literal interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney, unless one is using the right hand side column.There were and are no known exceptions.
-Lionel Andrades

If the Holy Office suggested that implicit desire was an exception, to the literal interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney, then it would be saying that a hypothethical case is an exception ?

All salvation is hypothetical, Lionel; no exceptions.
Lionel:
So if the Holy Office suggested that implicit desire was an exception, to the literal interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney, then it would be saying that a hypothethical case is an exception ? It would be a mistake ?
-Lionel Andrades

Supporters of Fr.Leonard Feeney unfortunately still use the irrational inference .It can be seen in their interpretation of Vatican Council II

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/06/supporters-of-frleonard-feeney.html#links
 

Archbishop Lefebvre made a mistake with the Letter of the Holy Office and carried it over into Vatican Council II  ttp://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/06/archbishop-lefebvre-made-mistake-with.html#links

Where does the Letter of the Holy Office make a factual error ? 
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/06/where-does-letter-of-holy-office-make.html#links
 
Implicit desire is always implicit. Did the Holy Office assume it was explicit?  

http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/06/implicit-desire-is-always-implicit-did.html#links

Ecclesiastical blackmail?

Fr Frederico Lombardi says the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate must be obedient to the pope. The pope ' remains the essential point of reference for every religious institute that does not wish to become an association of people who embark on an autonomous path, of their own volition, and eventually disperse.'(1)
 He means that the FFI must accept Vatican Council II interpreted with the right hand side, red column.They must accept the irrational column to remain in the Catholic Church. If they accept Vatican Council II with the blue column, the left hand side column, would it be accepted by him?
 
All salvation referred to in Vatican Council II i.e saved in invincible ignorance (LG 16), imperfect communion with the Church (UR 3),seeds of the Word (AG 11), good and holy things in other religions (NA 2) etc are either:

LEFT HAND SIDE COLUMN or   RIGHT HAND COLUMN

implicit                                   or   explicit for us.
hypothetical                          or   known in reality.
invisible                                 or   visible in the flesh.
dejure ( in principle)             or   defacto ( in fact ).
subjective                              or   objective.

So the Franciscans of the Immaculate can choose from the left hand side or the right hand side column.
If the right hand side column is chosen then Vatican Council II contradicts itself. LG 16 ( invincible ignorance is an exception to 'all' needing  'faith and baptism') is contradicted by Ad Gentes 7. AG 7 like the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus says  all need to convert into the Catholic Church.

If the left hand side column is chosen then Vatican Council II does not contradict itself. LG 16 does not contradict AG 7 and LG 14.

The Vatican interprets Vatican Council II with the right hand side values.

 Pope Francis does not interpret Vatican Council II with the blue, left hand side column. This has to be accepted  by the Franciscans of the Immaculate Friars and Sisters and all Catholics ?
 
To force the Franciscans of the Immaculate to accept an irrationality which was not part of the Deposit of the Faith before 1949 and then to threathen them with eventual dispersion is blackmail.Ecclesiastical blackmail.
 The Franciscans of the Immaculate are obligated to accept Vatican Council II but not with the red column, the right hand side interpretation.They have an obligation to reject this irrational version .
-Lionel Andrades
1.
Fr.Frederico Lombardi does not address doctrinal questions on Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate
 
 
July 8, 2014

 
 
 
There are Catholic religious and lay persons who use the the left hand side column in the interpretation of magisterial text
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2014/06/there-are-catholic-religious-and-lay.html#links
 
 


 

How Is This Happening? - Michael Voris


Lay Catholics can end the Franciscans of the Immaculate, SSPX problem

 
Lay Catholics, not necessarily only traditionalists, can end the Franciscans of the Immaculate, Society of St.Pius X problem, their canonical recognition with all faculties, by showing Pope Francis that Vatican Council ILL can be interpreted with the blue or red column. There is a choice.
 
 
May be through meetings with Vatican officials they can explain that Vatican Council II can be  interpreted  with the blue side column and the red one can be avoided.
 
They could show the Vatican Curia, that they the Vatican is using the the red column in the interpretation of the Council.This is irrational, not real, non traditional and not Catholics.
 
 They can explain , to the representatives of Pope Francis that the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate and the SSPX must be allowed to choose the blue column in the interpretation of Vatican Council II.
 
 
 
 
They will be affirming Vatican Council II, with rationality, and will meet the conditions necessary for offering the Traditional Latin Mass, to teach at their own seminary and receive full canonical status with normal faculties.
 
Aside from personal meetings announcements can be placed in the media by lay Catholics affirming their acceptance of Vatican Council II interpreted with the blue side column.
Once cardinals and bishops understand this they also will affirm Vatican Council II with the blue hand side column.
-Lionel Andrades