(Note: March 30.014 all my comments/replies are available on Protect the Pope.http://protectthepope.com/?p=10239 )
ITC,Vatican unknowingly made the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error.
ITC,Vatican unknowingly made the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error.
In the ITC's 'Christianity and the World Religions' and 'The Hope of Salvation for Infants who die without being baptized' the pope is supposed to have assumed the dead are visible in the flesh for us.Since for him there are known exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, according to the ITC.
It is a fact that humans in general cannot see the deceased now saved in Heaven. ITC says Pope Pius XII faulted Fr.Leonard Feeney for his literal interpretation of Vatican Council II which did not take into account 'this fact' of there being exceptions.
There are exceptions?!! Pope Pius XII believed the dead are visible!
The Holy Office did not issue a correction in the late 1940's upto 1965 when Vatican Council II concluded.No pope commented on this issue.Pope Benedict XVI approved the two theological papers of the ITC which carry the same objective error.It is alleged that ther are visible exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. Throughout the centuries it is implied, in the Catholic Church they did not know about this error, clarified in the 1940's by Pope Pius XII, that of visible-dead being exceptions to the dogma.
The Holy Office did not issue a correction in the late 1940's upto 1965 when Vatican Council II concluded.No pope commented on this issue.Pope Benedict XVI approved the two theological papers of the ITC which carry the same objective error.It is alleged that ther are visible exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. Throughout the centuries it is implied, in the Catholic Church they did not know about this error, clarified in the 1940's by Pope Pius XII, that of visible-dead being exceptions to the dogma.
Even Pope Francis in his last exhortation Evangelii Gaudium presented the Protestant kerygma which excludes the necessity of the Catholic Church for salvation, the necessity of 'faith and baptism'(AG 7) in the Catholic Church for all.Since there were known exceptions?
The President of the ITC, when this claim was made about Pope Pius XII, was a Jesuit priest too.He is now Cardinal Luiz Ladaria S.J, the Secretary of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith , Vatican (Holy Office).Some of his books are on display in the corridor of the Gregorian Pontifical University, Rome.He was a liberal professor of theology there.Now they have a new department, called boldly The Department of the Theology of Religions.The Theology of Religions, is mentioned in one of the ITC papers and is based on 'the fact' of being able to see the deceased-saved.These visible-dead cases are exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, the Catechism of Pope Pius X (27 Q), the Catechism of the Catholic Church (846- all need to enter the Church as through a door) and other magisterial documents.May be even the professors of theology at the Gregorian University can see the deceased walking on the streets of Rome.
The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith along with the ITC imply- that those saved with the baptism of desire or in invincible ignorance (LG 16) are physically visible to us on earth.So everyone does not have to convert into the Catholic Church in 2014 with 'faith and baptism' (Vatican Council II) . Since there are visible exceptions . Personally known to them, exceptions. Nostra Aetate 2 becomes is a break with the past with these visible non Catholics saved in their religion.It is another exception to the centuries old interpretation.If these cases were not visible on earth in human form, NA 2 would not be a break with tradition. Vatican Council II would be traditional also with UR 3, LG 8,LG 16 etc.
By now it must be clear to many Catholics especially those who had been following the discussion on the blog Protect the Pope , that the ITC has made a factual error. It is the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error common in the Church among liberals and traditionalists.
The ITC has not made the distinction between the concepts implicit-explicit, subjective-objective,invisible-visible.On the contrary its members have assumed that what is hypothetical is defacto known in reality.The possibility of being saved in invincible ignorance for example, is considered a known reality in specific cases.
About the author and editor of the blog Protect the Pope.
From its inception to the beginning of March 2014, Rev Nick Donnelly, was the main author and editor of this blog. At this time he is in a period of relection and prayer. Nick is a permanent deacon of the Diocese of Lancaster, and an author for the Catholic Truth Society. He holds a BA Divinity in Theology and a Masters in Spiritual Formation. Protect the Pope is a private initiative and is in no way officially associated with the Diocese of Lancaster.
From its inception to the beginning of March 2014, Rev Nick Donnelly, was the main author and editor of this blog. At this time he is in a period of relection and prayer. Nick is a permanent deacon of the Diocese of Lancaster, and an author for the Catholic Truth Society. He holds a BA Divinity in Theology and a Masters in Spiritual Formation. Protect the Pope is a private initiative and is in no way officially associated with the Diocese of Lancaster.
From Protect the Pope, 'Lionel Andrades and Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus' (2)
It might be noted
INTERNATIONAL THEOLOGICAL COMMISSION
CHRISTIANITY AND THE WORLD RELIGIONS
(1997) PRELIMINARY NOTE
The study of the theme “Christianity and the World Religions” was adopted for study by a large majority of the members of the International Theological Commission. …..The present text was approved “in forma specifica” by vote of the commission on 30 September 1996 and was submitted to its president, Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, who has given his approval for its publication.
Lionel:
They have unknowingly, at ITC, made the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error.
8. The fundamental question is this: Do religions mediate salvation to their members? There are those who give a negative reply to this question; even more, some do not even see any sense in raising it. Others give an affirmative response, which in turn gives rise to other questions: Are such mediations of salvation autonomous or do they convey the salvation of Jesus Christ? It is a question therefore of defining the status of Christianity and of religions as sociocultural realities in their relation to human salvation. This question should not be confused with that of the salvation of individuals, Christian or otherwise. Due account has not always been taken of this distinction.
Lionel:
According to Vatican Council II (Ad Gentes 7) all need 'faith and baptism' for salvation.In Heaven there are only Catholics who are there without mortal sin and with faith and baptism. The majority of people on earth who die without converting into the Catholic Church with faith and baptism are oriented to Hell according to Vatican Council II (AG 7, CCC 846 etc)
9. Many attempts have been made to classify the different theological positions adopted toward this problem. Let us see some of these classifications: Christ against religions, in religions, above religions, beside religions. An ecclesiocentric universe or exclusive Christology; a Christocentric universe or inclusive Christology; a theocentric universe with a normative Christology; a theocentric universe with a non-normative Christology. Some theologians adopt the tripartite division exclusivism, inclusivism, pluralism, which is seen as parallel to another: ecclesiocentrism, Christocentrism, theocentrism. Given that we have to choose one of these classifications in order to continue our reflection, we will follow the latter, even though we might complement it with the others if necessary.
Lionel:
With no known exceptions in 2014 to the traditional and literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, there is no change in ecclesiology (understanding of Church). Since there are no known exceptions mentioned in Vatican Council II to the dogma on exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church.There is no New Revelation in Vatican Council II. Ad Gentes 7 affirms the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and LG 16, LG 8,NA 2, UR 3 etc are not exceptions,since they don't exist in our reality.
10. Exclusivist ecclesiocentrism—the fruit of a specific theological system or of a mistaken understanding of the phrase extra ecclesiam nulla salus—is no longer defended by Catholic theologians after the clear statements of Pius XII and Vatican Council II on the possibility of salvation for those who do not belong visibly to the Church (cf, e.g., LG 16; GS 22).
Lionel:
Here we come to the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error in this ITC paper.
Catholic theologians referred to here could include the liberal theologian in dissent, Fr.John Hicks.
INTERNATIONAL THEOLOGICAL COMMISSION
CHRISTIANITY AND THE WORLD RELIGIONS
(1997) PRELIMINARY NOTE
The study of the theme “Christianity and the World Religions” was adopted for study by a large majority of the members of the International Theological Commission. …..The present text was approved “in forma specifica” by vote of the commission on 30 September 1996 and was submitted to its president, Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, who has given his approval for its publication.
Lionel:
They have unknowingly, at ITC, made the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error.
8. The fundamental question is this: Do religions mediate salvation to their members? There are those who give a negative reply to this question; even more, some do not even see any sense in raising it. Others give an affirmative response, which in turn gives rise to other questions: Are such mediations of salvation autonomous or do they convey the salvation of Jesus Christ? It is a question therefore of defining the status of Christianity and of religions as sociocultural realities in their relation to human salvation. This question should not be confused with that of the salvation of individuals, Christian or otherwise. Due account has not always been taken of this distinction.
Lionel:
According to Vatican Council II (Ad Gentes 7) all need 'faith and baptism' for salvation.In Heaven there are only Catholics who are there without mortal sin and with faith and baptism. The majority of people on earth who die without converting into the Catholic Church with faith and baptism are oriented to Hell according to Vatican Council II (AG 7, CCC 846 etc)
9. Many attempts have been made to classify the different theological positions adopted toward this problem. Let us see some of these classifications: Christ against religions, in religions, above religions, beside religions. An ecclesiocentric universe or exclusive Christology; a Christocentric universe or inclusive Christology; a theocentric universe with a normative Christology; a theocentric universe with a non-normative Christology. Some theologians adopt the tripartite division exclusivism, inclusivism, pluralism, which is seen as parallel to another: ecclesiocentrism, Christocentrism, theocentrism. Given that we have to choose one of these classifications in order to continue our reflection, we will follow the latter, even though we might complement it with the others if necessary.
Lionel:
With no known exceptions in 2014 to the traditional and literal interpretation of the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, there is no change in ecclesiology (understanding of Church). Since there are no known exceptions mentioned in Vatican Council II to the dogma on exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church.There is no New Revelation in Vatican Council II. Ad Gentes 7 affirms the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus and LG 16, LG 8,NA 2, UR 3 etc are not exceptions,since they don't exist in our reality.
10. Exclusivist ecclesiocentrism—the fruit of a specific theological system or of a mistaken understanding of the phrase extra ecclesiam nulla salus—is no longer defended by Catholic theologians after the clear statements of Pius XII and Vatican Council II on the possibility of salvation for those who do not belong visibly to the Church (cf, e.g., LG 16; GS 22).
Lionel:
Here we come to the Cushing-Jesuit Factual Error in this ITC paper.
Catholic theologians referred to here could include the liberal theologian in dissent, Fr.John Hicks.
'after the clear statements of Pius XII and Vatican Council II on the possibility of salvation for those who do not belong visibly to the Church (cf, e.g., LG 16; GS 22).'
ITC is telling us that those saved in invincible ignorance (LG 16) for example 'who do not belong visibly to the Church' can be saved. ITC implies that these cases are visible for us, personally known, for them to be exceptions to the literal and traditional interpretation of the dogma according to Fr.Leonard Feeney.
This is a factual error. Since we cannot see the dead who are saved in Heaven and who were in invincible ignorance. We cannot name any such person.So how can a possibility be considered an exception.
11. Christocentrism accepts that salvation may occur in religions, but it denies them any autonomy in salvation on account of the uniqueness and universality of the salvation that comes from Jesus Christ. This position is undoubtedly the one most commonly held by Catholic theologians, even though there are differences among them. It attempts to reconcile the universal salvific will of God with the fact that all find their fulfillment as human beings within a cultural tradition that has in the corresponding religion its highest expression and its ultimate foundation.
Lionel:
Due to allegedly known exceptions the ITC has rejected traditional ecclesiology for a vague Christocentrism.
Also if someone is saved in another religion through Christ it is not known to us in 2014 to be an exception to the literal interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney. Again the ITC is implying that those saved in other religions through Jesus and the Church are visible to be exceptions to Traditonal ecclesiology.
66. In his encyclical Mystici Corporis, Pius XII addresses the question, How are those who attain salvation outside visible communion with the Church related to her? He says that they are oriented to the mystical body of Christ by a yearning and desire of which they are not aware (DS 3821).
Lionel:
In Mystici Corporis Pope Pius XII does not state that these cases are visible for us.Neither does he state that possibilities are known exceptions to the traditional interpretation of the dogma on exclusive salvation.ITC implies he does. ITC implies he made an objective error.
The opposition of the American Jesuit Leonard Feeney, who insisted on the exclusivist interpretation of the expression extra ecclesiam nulla solus, afforded the occasion for the letter of the Holy Office, dated 8 August ,1949, to the archbishop of Boston, which rejected Feeney s interpretation and clarified the teaching of Pius XII.
Lionel:
The ITC is saying here that Fr.Leonard Feeney's interpretation of there being exclusive salvation in the Catholic Church with no exceptions, was rejected by Pope Pius XII.It was rejected since the pope thought there are known exceptions. Implicit desire mentioned in the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 was a known exceptions.The pope was saying there were exceptions. If there were exceptions it means these cases would have to be known to the pope.
The letter distinguishes between the necessity of belonging to the Church for salvation (necessitas praecepti) and the necessity of the indispensable means of salvation (intrinseca necessitas); in relationship to the latter, the Church is a general help for salvation (DS 3867—69).
Lionel:
'the necessity of belonging to the Church for salvation (necessitas praecepti) and the necessity of the indispensable means of salvation (intrinseca necessitas)'
How is this related to the dogma? Either way it is known only to God.So how is it relevant to the interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney ? Unless , of course, the ITC considers these cases visible for us and assumes Pope Pius XII could also, like God, see the dead-saved as such.
In the case of invincible ignorance the implicit desire of belonging to the Church suffices; this desire will always be present when a man aspires to conform his will to that of God (DS 3870). But faith, in the sense of Hebrews 11:6, and love are always necessary with intrinsic necessity (DS 3872).
Lionel:Again, how is being saved in invincible ignorance a known exception to the interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney. These cases are invisible for us. So did Pope Pius XII make a mistake according to the ITC ?
67. Vatican Council II makes its own the expression extra ecclesiam nulla salus. But in using it the council explicitly directs itself to Catholics and limits its validity to those who know the necessity of the Church for salvation.
Lionel:
'those who know the necessity of the Church for salvation'.
This is known only to God, so why mention it? We cannot know who was in invincible ignorance and was saved. We cannot know in 2014 who 'knew' and did not enter the Church and is condemned. Does ITC imply that these are visible exceptions to the teaching which says all need to enter the Church visibly (with faith and baptism) to go to Heaven and avoid Hell ?
The council holds that the affirmation is based on the necessity of faith and of baptism affirmed by Christ (LG 14). In this way the council aligned itself in continuity with the teaching of Pius XII, but emphasized more clearly the original parenthentical character of this expression.
Lionel:
'but emphasized more clearly the original parenthentical character of this expression.'
What is the parentehtical charachter of the expression extra ecclesiam nulla salus ? The dead-saved who are now in Heaven are visible expressions to all needing to convert into the Church?
-Lionel Andrades
164. In catechesis too, we have rediscovered the fundamental role of the first announcement or kerygma, which needs to be the centre of all evangelizing activity and all efforts at Church renewal. The kerygma is trinitarian. The fire of the Spirit is given in the form of tongues and leads us to believe in Jesus Christ who, by his death and resurrection, reveals and communicates to us the Father’s infinite mercy. On the lips of the catechist the first proclamation must ring out over and over: “Jesus Christ loves you; he gave his life to save you; and now he is living at your side every day to enlighten, strengthen and free you.” This first proclamation is called “first” not because it exists at the beginning and can then be forgotten or replaced by other more important things. It is first in a qualitative sense because it is the principal proclamation, the one which we must hear again and again in different ways, the one which we must announce one way or another throughout the process of catechesis, at every level and moment. For this reason too, “the priest – like every other member of the Church – ought to grow in awareness that he himself is continually in need of being evangelized”.
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