PECCATO MORTALE DARE UNA DONAZIONE AD EWTN QUESTO NATALE

Secondo il Catechismo della Chiesa Cattolica quando causa di peccato è materia grave ed esso è commesso liberamente e deliberatamente e un peccato mortale. Secondo Veritatis Splendor un peccato mortale è sempre un peccato mortale. L’azione esterna indica l'intenzione interna.

Materia grave: Eternal Word Television Network, USA/Canada (EWTN) nega/cambia sul loro sito web e televisione programmi the ex cathedra dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. Questo insegnamento infallibile Cattolici devono essere creduti e non essere negato in pubblico.

Deliberatamente: EWTN continua una politica su questo soggetto che è la stessa dei nemici della chiesa (Sionisti). EWTN è stato informato molte volte direttamente ed i rapporti esistono sull’Internet.

Qui è l'ex dogma del cathedra che è al centro della polemica d’EWTN.

1. “There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved.” (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215). Ex cathedra.

2.“We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” (Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unam Sanctam, 1302.).Ex cathedra.

3.“The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra – from the website Catholicism.org and “No Salvation outside the Church”: Link List, the Three Dogmatic Statements Regarding EENS http://nosalvationoutsideofthecatholicchurch.blogspot.com/

Tuttavia l’interpretazione rigorista dell’extra eccleisam nulla salus e un insegnamento magistero della chiesa cattolica e la chiesa non mai hanno ritratto. Il Concilio Vaticano II ha lo stesso messaggio.

Così darete la vostra donazione ad un'organizzazione che rifiuta un ex cathedra infallibile insegnamento ? EWTN la cambia per adattarsi alle interpretazioni strane del Concilio e del Catechismo. Queste interpretazioni senza testo sopportavano del Concilio Vaticano II sono una rottura da Sacra Tradizione.

Madre Angelica la fondatrice dell’EWTN, era favore di questo dogma. Ha avuto una pagina speciale sull’extra ecclesiam nulla salus sul sitoweb d’EWTN. Questa pagina con la dichiarazione dei Padri della Chiesa è stata rimossa dalla nuova amministrazione e dal locale vescovo. Madre Angelica dovuto lasciare EWTN in nome d’obbedienza. Ha permesso che EWTN fosse rilevato da coloro che si oppone al interpretazione rigorista extra ecclesiam nulla salus.

È dunque necessario che tutti si convertano al Cristo conosciuto attraverso la predicazione della Chiesa, ed a lui e alla Chiesa, suo corpo, siano incorporati attraverso il battesimo (39). Cristo stesso infatti, « ribadendo espressamente la necessità della fede e del battesimo (cfr. Mc 16,16; Gv 3,5), ha confermato simultaneamente la necessità della Chiesa, nella quale gli uomini entrano, per così dire, attraverso la porta del battesimo.-Ad Gentes 7, Concilio Vaticano II

La pagina del Madre Angelica sul sitoweb di EWTN è stata sostituita da Jeffrey Mirus Presidente Trinità Communications.

MESSAGE INCOMPLETE

IT'S A MORTAL SIN TO GIVE A DONATION TO EWTN THIS CHRISTMAS

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church when the subject of a sin is grave matter, and it is committed freely and knowingly then it is a mortal sin. According to Veritatis Splendor a mortal sin is always a mortal sin and the external action indicates the internal intention.

Grave matter: The Eternal Word Television Network (EWTN) denies/changes the ex cathedra dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, on their website and television programs.This 'infallible' teaching (Pope Pius XII,Letter of the Holy Office 1949) must be firmly believed.It is not to be denied in  public by Catholics.

Knowingly: EWTN continues a policy on this issue which is the same as the enemies of the Church (Zionists). EWTN has been informed many times directly and through reports on the Internet.

Here is the ex cathedra dogma which is at the centre of the EWTN controversy.

1. “There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved.” (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215). Ex cathedra.

2.“We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” (Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unam Sanctam, 1302.).Ex cathedra.

3.“The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra – from the website Catholicism.org and “No Salvation outside the Church”: Link List, the Three Dogmatic Statements Regarding EENS http://nosalvationoutsideofthecatholicchurch.blogspot.com//

Yet the ‘rigorist interpretation’ is a Magisterial teaching of the Catholic Church and the Church has not retracted, at any time, extra ecclesiam nulla salus.Vatican Council II has the same message.

So will you give your donation to an organisation which rejects an infallible ex cathedra teaching? EWTN changes it to adapt to wild interpretations of the Council and Catechism. These interpretations with no supportive text from Vatican Council II  are a break from Sacred Tradition.

Therefore, all must be converted to Him, made known by the Church's preaching, and all must be incorporated into Him by baptism and into the Church which is His body. For Christ Himself "by stressing in express language the necessity of faith and baptism (cf. Mark 16:16; John 3:5), at the same time confirmed the necessity of the Church, into which men enter by baptism, as by a door…-Ad Gentes 7.Vatican Council II.

Mother Angelica, EWTN’s founder, was supportive of this dogma. She had a special page on extra ecclesiam nulla salus(EENS) placed on the EWTN website. That page with the quotations of the Church Fathers, affirming the rigorist interpretation of EENS,  was removed by the new management and the local bishop. Mother Angelica had to leave EWTN. In the name of obedience she allowed EWTN to be taken over by those who oppose the ‘rigorist interpretation’ of the extra ecclesiam nulla salus.

Mother Angelica‘s page was replaced on the website created by Trinity Communications' Jeffrey Mirus. He placed on the EWTN website a heretical article by the late Fr. William Most. It called the Church Fathers teachings cited by Mother Angelica, as ‘restrictive texts’. It never mentioned that the ‘restrictive texts’ were ex cathedra. He claimed the dogma does not say everyone needs to be a formal, invisible ‘card carrying’ member of the Catholic Church. He then began misinterpreting Vatican Council II to adapt to his heresy.

Fr. Most, Jeffrey Mirus of Catholic Culture  and Patrick Madrid say on EWTN that the dogma does not claim everyone must be a formal, visible member of the Church to go to Heaven and avoid Hell.

Here is part of the dogma which says just that!

it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” (Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unam Sanctam, 1302.).Ex cathedra.

none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation

No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra

It's a mortal sin to knowingly give a donation to EWTN.

Here are Fr. William Most's claims:

1) The ex cathedra dogma on salvation does not state everyone needs to be a formal, visible member of the Church to go to Heaven and avoid Hell.

2) He indicates Fr. Leonard Feeney was excommunicated for affirming the rigorist interpretation of the dogma. No text is cited as proof (See at the end of this report  Letter to the Holy Office, Updated Apologetics- extra ecclesiam nulla salus).

3) He believes that this infallible teaching does not teach that God will send millions of people to Hell.

For centuries the Church taught that millions of people are on the path to Hell.Now EWTN gives us a new doctrine, a new interpretation and claims it’s a Catholic teaching.

Extra ecclesiam nulla salus has now been politicised. It is rejected by the leftists-secularists who do not even want any mention of Hell. The Cantate Domino, Council of Florence, ex cathedra, says clearly- that Hell has fire.

So EWTN has to accept extra ecclesiam nulla salus seen by many as an ideological issue similar to abortion and homosexuality. While EWTN opposes abortion and homosexuality, on extra ecclesiam nulla salus, it has the same position as Masons, Communists and those working for the coming of the Anti Christ.

This is grave matter. The subject of mortal sin.

Give your money to Catholic communities who affirm ‘the rigorist interpretation’ of extra ecclesiam nulla salus.For example The Sisters of St. Benedict Centre Worcester, USA, by email: info@sistersofstbenedictcenter.org

By mail:

Sisters of Saint Benedict Center

Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary

254 Still River Road

Still River, MA 01467-0022

Or

Donate to the Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, Richmond New Hampshire, USA. The Diocese of Manchester has appointed a chaplain  for this community.

Slaves of the Immaculate Heart of Mary Saint Benedict Center

Post Office Box 627

Richmond, New Hampshire 03470,USA

Give your money to Catholic communities whose life opposes the lies of EWTN; individuals who want to hold extra ecclesiam nulla salus Conferences.Help start advocacy groups for those Catholics marginalised for affirming the Church's teaching on extra ecclesiam nulla salus.

Remember to deny an ex cathedra dogma is serious. Fr. Tissa Balasuriya OMI was excommunicated by Pope John Paul II.He denied the Immaculate Conception of Our Lady.

So if between ‘your gas and electric bill’ you send money to EWTN you are cooperating with an organization controlled by religious who are in grave sin. You are placing your soul at risk. You will also go to receive the Eucharist at Mass in this condition. Please do not send EWTN money and then at Mass go forward to receive the Eucharist.

For secular organisations, charity includes donations for homosexuality and abortion. This is not the concept of charity for the Catholic Church.

Do not think that since the U.S bishops do not correct EWTN it is truly Catholic. EWTN is supported by U.S bishops who do not think it is a mortal sin, for bishops and priests, to give the Eucharist to pro abortion politicians.

There are also cardinals who believe Jews do not have to convert in the present times. The same message has been expressed by Jewish leaders on a program telecast by EWTN, according to the website of the apologist Robert Sungenis. Sungenis who keeps repeating that the Bible says Jews need to convert is prohibited from appearing on EWTN. It’s been many years now that he has been banned by the EWTN management.

It’s the influential Jewish Left which decides who can appear on EWTN and what can be said or not said by Catholics approved by them.

Apologist Patrick Madrid has been approved. On EWTN Radio I heard him say that evangelisation is important. In answer to a question, he said, everyone needs to enter the Church except for those in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire etc. This is a contradiction of the ex cathedra dogma and so a heretical statement.

He is implying that he knows of personal cases of people with the baptism of desire or invincible ignorance.Only God knows explicit (visible) cases of the baptism of desire or invincible ignorance.For Madrid it is implicit (hidden).So why does he make a vague statement on EWTN Radio that everyone needs to enter the Church except for those …? It’s irrelevant.Why mention it ? We do not know of  a single case in the present time.So it does not contradict the dogma.

Those saved with implicit-to-us invincible ignorance are known only to God and so it does not contradict Cantate Domino.

Since invincible ignorance and the baptism of desire are not explicit to us it does not contradict Vatican Council II (Ad Gentes 7).

The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra

Therefore, all must be converted to Him, made known by the Church's preaching, and all must be incorporated into Him by baptism and into the Church which is His body. For Christ Himself "by stressing in express language the necessity of faith and baptism (cf. Mark 16:16; John 3:5), at the same time confirmed the necessity of the Church, into which men enter by baptism, as by a door.-Ad Gentes 7,Vatican Council II.

Those saved with invincible ignorance and the baptism of desire which is only a concept for us does not contradict the Catechism of the Catholic Church, CCC 847,848 does not contradict CCC 845,846.

To reunite all his children, scattered and led astray by sin, the Father willed to call the whole of humanity together into his Son's Church. The Church is the place where humanity must rediscover its unity and salvation. The Church is "the world reconciled." She is that bark which "in the full sail of the Lord's cross, by the breath of the Holy Spirit, navigates safely in this world." According to another image dear to the Church Fathers, she is prefigured by Noah's ark, which alone saves from the flood.-Catechism of the Catholic Church n.845


"Outside the Church there is no salvation"


846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:


Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.-Catechism of the Catholic Church 846 (Emphasis added. Note: To enter as through a door was the term used by the Church Fathers for the rigorist interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus.)

LG 16 and CCC 847,848 do not oppose Dominus Iesus 20. Since the reference to implicit salvation does not contradict the need for explicit entry into the Church for salvation.

Above all else, it must be firmly believed that “the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and baptism (cf. Mk 16:16; Jn 3:5), and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through baptism as through a door”.77 This doctrine must not be set against the universal salvific will of God (cf. 1 Tim 2:4); “it is necessary to keep these two truths together, namely, the real possibility of salvation in Christ for all mankind and the necessity of the Church for this salvation”.-Dominus Iesus 20 (Emphasis added)

 It is not contrary to Pope John Paul II’s encyclical Ecclesia di Eucarestia (2003) which indicates that everyone needs the Eucharist in the Catholic Church for salvation.

Patrick Madrid needs to say :

1.There can be people saved who are in invincible ignorance etc and THEY WILL BE KNOWN ONLY TO GOD.

2.While everyone WITH NO EXCEPTION needs to be a formal, visible member of the Catholic Church to got to Heaven avoid Hell.


These two teachings (1and 2) do not have to be contradictory.Patrick Madrid needs to correct himself on EWTN. So why MUST he say it is an exception to the infallible teaching? It's a straw man. It’s a way to change and deny the dogma on EWTN. Patrick Madrid is irrational. Since how can he say everyone needs to enter the Church and yet also say there are people one can know who do not have to enter the church for salvation.Patrick Madrid is irrational. Since how can he say everyone needs to enter the Church and yet also say there are people one can know who do not have to enter the church for salvation ? This ambiguity could result in many people spending all eternity at furnace temperature.



It is contrary to the Principle of Non Contradiction. It is implying that explicitly everyone needs to enter the Church for salvation and explicitly there are people saved with the baptism of desire, invincible ignorance etc.

This is a new doctrine that has been brought into the Catholic Church since the 1950's by Cardinal Cushing and the Jesuits at Boston.

Yet many of these errors are there in EWTN's heretical report Tragic Errors of Leonard Feeney placed on the Internet by Jeffrey Mirus’ Trinity Communications. Mirus, is president of Catholic Culture, another organisation whose staff members should not receive the Eucharist.

Catholics can say that as a concept, a probability known only to God a person can be saved in invincible ignorance, with the baptism of desire or blood. However this is only hypothetical for us and not an actuality now; not a reality that we know of. We do not know of a single case of the baptism of desire in the present times or the last 100 years.

The EWTN report on the Internet is:

1. A rejection of the Vatican Council II, Ad Gentes 7 which states ‘all people’ need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation.

2. A rejection of the Catechism of the Catholic Church 845 a misrepresentation of CCC 1257, The Necessity of Baptism.

3. It’s a misrepresentation of Lumen Gentium 16, Vatican Council II.

Remember - EWTN’s stand on this issue is the same as that of the Masons. Your donation to EWTN this Christmas means encouraging their false teachings. EWTN is denying the truth. Or, they hide it so that is barely noticeable.

A Catholic does not send money to an organisation that promotes abortion.

A Catholic does not send money to an organisation that denies or changes an ex cathedra dogma.

Don’t commit a mortal sin. The issue is grave matter and you have been informed.

____________________________________________________

CDF PLEASE REVIEW MICHAEL MAZZA AND FR. MOST'S ARTICLES ON THE INTERNET FOR DOCTRINAL ERRORS : EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2010/11/cdf-please-review-michael-mazza-and-fr.html#links



LEGIONARIES OF CHRIST PRIESTS IN ROME DO NOT DENY THAT THEY AFFIRM AND TEACH THE SECULAR, LIBERAL, PROGRESSIVIST INTERPRETATION OF EXTRA ECLESIAM NULLA SALUS (Sabato.Dec.4, 2010)
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2010/12/legionaries-of-christ-priests-in-rome.html#links

CARDINAL RATZINGER AFFIRMED IN THE CATECHISM THE RIGORIST INTERPRETATION OF THE DOGMA EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS?-1
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2010/08/cardinal-ratzinger-affirmed-in.html#links


CARDINAL RATZINGER AFFIRMED IN THE CATECHISM THE RIGORIST INTERPRETATION OF THE DOGMA EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS? 2
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2010/08/cardinal-ratzinger-affirmed-in_16.html#links

____________________________________________________

UPDATED APOLOGETICS: EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS

1. LETTER OF THE HOLY OFFICE 1949

In the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 Pope Pius XII said all Jews in Boston are on the way to Hell and they need to convert. He indicated this when he referred to the ‘dogma’, ‘the infallible teaching’.

2. VATICAN COUNCIL II, LUMEN GENTIUM 16

There cannot be an explicit baptism of desire that we know of, neither can we judge cases of explicit invincible ignorance since we cannot read the heart of any person.

LG 16 refers to something implicit, known only as a concept. Probable, possible but not a reality. We do not know explicitly or implicitly (in principle) any case of a good conscience, the baptism of desire or blood or invincible ignorance in the present times or the last 100 years (If the Church declares that someone is a martyr only the Church has the right to judge).

3. FR. LEONARD FEENEY NOT EXCOMMNICATED FOR HERESY

There is no church document which says he was excommunicated for heresy. He was excommunicated for disobedience. Over time it has become clear that it was the Archbishop and Jesuits at Boston who rejected the rigorist interpretation of the ex. cathedra dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.The Archbishop Richard Cushing never issued a clarification when the Boston newspapers reported that eh Church has changed its centuries old teaching.

4. INFALLIBLE DOGMAS DO NOT DEVELOP

There is no Church document to support the position that the ex cathedra dogma extra excclesiam nulla salus has been ‘developed’ or ‘changed’ or ‘retracted’. Infallible teachings defined three times do not 'develop'.

5. SALVATION OF CHRISTIANS (NON CATHOLICS)

Ad Gentes 7, Vatican Council Ii says all people need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation. No church document says Christians (non Catholics) religions are the ordinary way to salvation. If a Christian is saved in his religions it will be known to only God. God can provide the helps in this exceptional case, which could include the baptism of water. In Heaven there are only Catholics.

6.HERESY

In the Apostles and Nicene Creed we pray, ‘I believe in one baptism for the forgiveness of sin’ and ‘I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Holy Catholic Church’. Everyone needs the baptism of water to remove Original sin for salvation. It is the Holy Spirit which guides the Church to teach through the centuries the ‘rigorist interpretation’ of extra ecclesiam nulla salus. To reject the Nicene and Apostles Creed is a first class heresy in the hierarchy of truths. It would also be a rejection of the Athanasius Creed which states outside the church there is no salvation.

7. EUCHARIST

So it is mortal sin to change an ex cathedra dogma or to reject its meaning. It is a first class heresy.A person is automatically excommunicated.He has no right to receive the Eucharist at Mass.Neither can he offer Mass if he is a priest.He first needs to receive absolution in the Confessional and remove the public scandal.

8.SUPERIOR HAS TO BE A CATHOLIC

A Superior ( juridical person according to Canon Law ) has to be a Catholic. So he needs to affirm in public every ex cathedra dogma.Otherwise he cannot hold his office.Neither can one receive the Eucharist in this condition.

Here is the ex cathedra dogma which every Superior according to Canon Law are obligated to affirm and teach others.

1. “There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved.” (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215). Ex cathedra.

2.“We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” (Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unam Sanctam, 1302.).Ex cathedra.

3.“The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra – from the website Catholicism.org and “No Salvation outside the Church”: Link List, the Three Dogmatic Statements Regarding EENS

9.THERE ARE TWO INTERPRETATIONS OF VATICAN COUNCIL II

The first is: everyone needs to enter the Catholic Church for salvation (Ad Gentes 7) except for those in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire etc (LG 16).

The second is: everyone needs to be a visible, formal, ‘card-carrying member’ of the Catholic Church and there are no exceptions (AG 7) and if there was someone in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire or a good conscience it would be known only to God.

10. BAPTISM OF DESIRE IS NOT OPPOSED TO THE DOGMA

Baptism of desire is usually interpreted as being opposed to the dogma which says that everyone needs to be a visible, formal member of the Church with no exceptions. We can also interpret Vatican Council II as saying that everyone needs to be a visible member of the Church to avoid Hell and if there is anyone with the Baptism of desire or in invincible ignorance it will be known only to God.

There is no Church Document which suggests that baptism of desire, invincible ignorance should be placed in opposition to the need of formal entry into the Catholic Church for everyone with no exception.

11. CCC 1257 (THE NECESSITY OF BAPTISM) AND DE FACTO, DE JURE CONCEPT

The Catechism of the Catholic Church ( CCC 1257 ) refers to de facto salvation in the first part and de jure (in principle) salvation in the second part. Otherwise it would be ludicrous and make no sense.

It means Lumen Gentium 16 (LG 16) could refer to de jure (in principle) salvation.

If LG 16 is de jure then it is not in conflict with Ad Gentes 7, which states ,'all people' need Catholic Faith and the Baptism of water for salvation.LG 16 would be in accord with tradition.

If is not in conflict with AG 7 then it is not in conflict with the ex cathedra dogma which says everyone with no exception needs to de facto enter the Church for salvation and there are no exceptions.

12. SUPPORTERS OF FR.LEONARD FEENEY SAY THERE IS NO BAPTISM OF DESIRE

I could agree with them. It is true in a sense but it has to be clarified. Words could be used with precision.I would say they mean:

1.There is no explicit Baptism of desire (BOD).It cannot be external and seen.

2.There is no implicit baptism of desire (BOD).It cannot be known in principle in a particular time.

3.There is no BOD without the Sacraments.(So there could be a BOD with the Sacrament).

4.There is no explicit BOD without the Sacrament of the Baptism of water.

5.There is no implicit BOD without the Sacrament of the Baptism of water.

6.There is a BOD with the Sacrament of the Baptism of water known to us as a concept and something possible 'in certain circumstances' and known always only to God.

13.CONFUSION ON EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS

Here are some important comparisions on the extra ecclesiam nulla salus confusion.

A. The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that there are people who can be saved with the baptism of desire or blood, in invincible ignorance etc. Fine! And they are known only to God. It does not contradict the ex cathedra teaching that every one with no exception needs to enter the Church.

B. The teaching that there can be non Catholic saved in invincible ignorance etc is placed in opposition to the infallible teaching that everyone with no exception needs to enter the Church for salvation.

A. The Catechism states that outside the church there is no salvation means that all salvation comes from God and that whoever is saved is saved through Jesus and the Catholic Church. Fine. This is acceptable to us Catholics.

B. The Catechism states that outside the church there is no salvation means that all salvation comes from God and that whoever is saved , is saved through Jesus and the Church .So there can be people saved who are not formal members of the Church so everyone does not have to enter the church as the infallible teaching says.

A. Pope Pius XII in 1949 in the Letter of the Holy office mentioned 'the dogma' the 'infallible teaching' extra ecclesiam nulla salus. So the dogma is not something from medieval times. Pope Pius XII was saying through the Letter issued by Cardinal Ottaviani that all Jews in Boston and the rest of the world need to convert into the Catholic Church with no exception.

B. They suggest that the dogma is from medieval times.

A. No where in Vatican Council II is this theology presented. There is no text which claims everybody needs to enter the Church except for those in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire etc. It is an interpretation. Just one interpretation.

B. They claim it is the official teaching of Vatican Council II. It is repeated in the Catechism of the Catholic Church. They cannot cite any text.

A. It is heresy since it rejects an ex cathedra dogma which states everyone needs to enter the Church with no exceptions to avoid Hell (Cantate Domino, Council of Florence.

B. It is not heresy since it is the teaching of Vatican Council II and not just an interpretation, one of two interpretations.

A. There can be only one interpretation of an infallible teaching; the ex cathedra dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.

B. There is the ‘rigorist interpretation’ and the non rigorist.

A. It is also irrational since how can you say everyone needs to enter the Church and yet there are people one can know who do not have to enter the church for salvation?

B. It is not irrational. It is a ‘mystery’.

A. It is also contrary to the Principle of Non Contradiction. Since it is saying explicitly everyone needs to enter the Church for salvation and explicitly there can be people saved with the baptism of desire, invincible ignorance etc.

B. It is an accepted mystery of the Church.

A. It’s a straw man since explicitly we do not know any case in the present times of someone with the baptism of desire etc. Neither can we implicitly (in principle) know of any such case. The baptism of desire etc is accepted only as a concept a probability, known to God only. It is not an actuality for us, never.

B. The baptism of desire etc is explicit.

A. The Catholic Church has always taught and still teaches that everyone with no exception needs to enter the Church to avoid Hell. That there could be non Catholics saved in invincible ignorance etc does not contradict the infallible, ex cathedra teaching that everyone formally needs to be a Catholic to go to Heaven.

When the Catechism says those who know and yet do not enter it is referring to people, non Catholics, who are definitely going to Hell. This statement was placed in the Catechism to distinguish between those who will be saved in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire or blood or a good conscience.

Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.-Catechism of the Catholic Church 846

B. That there could be non Catholics saved in invincible ignorance etc contradicts the infallible, ex cathedra teaching that everyone formally needs to be a Catholic to go to Heaven.

A. Everyone needs to be a visible, formal, ‘card-carrying member’ of the Catholic Church and there are no exceptions (AG 7) and if there was someone in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire or a good conscience it would be known only to God.

B.The second is: everyone needs to enter the Catholic Church for salvation (Ad Gentes 7) except for those in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire etc (LG 16).

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http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2010/12/its-mortal-sin-to-give-donation-to-ewtn.html