Friday, August 13, 2010

TIM STAPLES ASKS ALAN SCHRECK : HOW DOES HE RECONCILE VATICAN COUNCIL II WITH THE DOGMA EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS: HE HAS NO ANSWER ON CATHOLIC ANSWERS

There is no mystery. It’s the media which has promoted a false interpretation of Vatican Council II (LG 16) and the apologists at Catholic answers have just accepted it, ‘hook, line and sinker’..( Catholic Answers Live MP3 on EENSThere were some good questions put to Schreck and Staples on this radio talk show on the subject of extra ecclesiam nulla salus which shows that the faith in the Catholic Church is still pure and the extra ecclesiam nulla salus movement is growing.




One questioner politely asked the host Alan Schreck if he was not ‘muddying the water’ when one consider the Bull Unam Sanctum of Pope Boniface VIII which was ex cathedraand said everyone needs to enter the Church for salvation. Another caller-in asked why is Feenyism wrong? He said that  there some communities of Fr. Leonard Feeney who have been accepted by the Catholic Church in Massachusetts and that  Fr. Feeney was not asked to recant by the church?

Schreck had his back to to the wall and was taking cover under phrases like ‘the fullness of salvation’ and ‘the fullness of truth’ and other vague, non committal statements, saying a lot but really, in a sense saying nothing.

His entire theology was faulted and this became obvious when a caller asked if there was a ‘false religion’. Schreck had to be diplomatic here and tip toe carefully since, Vatican Council II refers to the other religions (monotheistic?) as ‘the great religions’.

He was not prepared to really say that ‘the great religions’ are not  paths to salvation according to post Vatican Council II teaching (CDF, Notification, Dupuis 2001, Dominus Iesus 2000, Redemptoris Missio etc) and that there members need to enter the Catholic Church to avoid Hell (Dominus Iesus 20 etc).He seemed vague and confused here.

However in other instances they did say that Jesus Christ  founded only one Church, the Catholic Church and  it is through Jesus that God made a Covenant for all time with  all people. So the Chosen People of God are now only Catholics ( those baptized with the baptism of water and those with the baptism of desire etc).

Both Schreck and Staples expressed themselves well but had no theology to reconcile Vatican Council II with the dogma. Tim Staples was  frank enough to bring this to the attention of Alan Schreck after he seemed to have finished answering a caller’s question:how do you reconcile the dogma with Vatican Council II ?

Their  repeated errors were the following :

1. They both assumed Lumen Gentium 16 referred to explicit and not implicit Baptism of desire and invincible ignorance.

2. They seemed unaware that the dogma is ex cathedra, like the Immaculate Conception of Our Lady, and says everyone with no exception needs to be a formal member of the Church to avoid Hell.

3. They ignore Ad Gentes 7 which says all people need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation.
They make no distinction between de facto and dejure salvation, salvation in principle.

They obviously would have trouble with the Catechism of the Catholic Church 1257 which says the Church knows of no means to eternal beatitude other than the Baptism of water and also says God is not limited to the Sacraments.

Since they believe LG 16 refers to explicit Baptism of Desire they violate the Principle of Non Contradiction. They would be reasoning that de facto everyone needs the Baptism of Water and Catholic Faith to go to Heaven (AG 7,CCC 1257) and de facto there can also be people saved without the Sacrament of the Baptism of water (LG 16, CCC 1257). It does not make sense.

However if they both considered LG 16 as referring to de jure implicit salvation, something that we can  accept in principle but which is only known to God( it is only explicit for God and we do not know a single case of Baptism of Desire) then it would not violate the Principle on Non Contradiction.

CCC 1257 would clearly mean that de facto everyone needs the Baptism of water for salvation while de jure (in principle) a person can be saved without the Sacraments and this would be known only to God.

God would provide the person with the helps of salvation (St. Thomas Aquinas) like he did when he sent the Franciscan Friars to be present to the Sultan whom St. Francis of Assisi evangelized. They baptized the Muslim Sultan on his death bed and then escaped with their life.
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“The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra


– from the website Catholicism.org and “No Salvation outside the Church”: Link List, the Three Dogmatic Statements Regarding EENS

Therefore, all must be converted to Him, made known by the Church's preaching, and all must be incorporated into Him by baptism and into the Church which is His body. For Christ Himself "by stressing in express language the necessity of faith and baptism (cf. Mark 16:16; John 3:5), at the same time confirmed the necessity of the Church, into which men enter by baptism, as by a door.-Ad Gentes 7,Vatican Council II

Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience.-Lumen Gentium 16, Vatican Council II.

CATHOLIC ANSWERS, TIM STAPLES, ALAN SCHRECK CONTINUE IN HERESY: THEY REJECT AN EX CATHEDRA DOGMA AND VATICAN COUNCIL II

Catholic Answers has produced an audio tape of a radio program on the subject extra ecclesiam nulla salus.( Catholic Answers Live MP3 on EENS

 They have denied the contents of the ex cathedra dogma Cantate Domini, Council of Florence 1441 on outside the church there is no salvation,which states that Orthodox Christians and Jews need to convert for salvation. They reject Vatican Council II (Ad Gentes 7) which says all people need Catholic faith and the baptism of water for salvation. As in the past they interpret Lumen Gentium 16 according to the Jewish Left media as referring to explicit, knowable- to- us baptism of desire and invincible ignorance. This is contrary to rationality since the baptism of desire is always implicit for us. No Church Council, pope or saint refer to the Baptism of desire as explicit.

The audio also falsely suggests that Fr. Leonard Feeney was excommunicated for heresy. There is no Church Document to support this claim.

They had no answers to some questions put to them by callers , whose confusion was likely to have been increased still further. Since Tim Staples and Alan Schreck the participants in the program were unable to accept the rigorist interpretation of the ex cathedra dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus which according to Church Documents is the official teaching of the Catholic Church. Instead ,they were projecting a view popularized by the Jewish Left media and EWTN.

The ex cathedra, thrice defined dogma indicates that all Jews, Orthodox Christians, Protestants and Muslims are on the way to Hell unless they convert into the Catholic Church before they die.

The Catholic Answers program presented a major shift in church teaching based on pro Zionist interpretations,  for the Catholic Church.

A consistent error for Karl Keating’s Catholic Answers is that they interpret Vatican Council II (Lumen Gentium 16) as opposed to the ‘rigorist interpretation’ of the ex cathedra dogma which for centuries taught that everyone with no exception needs to be a visible member, a ‘card carrying member' of the Catholic Church to go to Heaven and avoid Hell.

Vatican Council II  is consistent with the dogma,though, without Catholic Answers heretical interpretations.

Since, everyone needs to be a visible member of the Church for salvation and there are no exceptions. If there is anyone with the Baptism of desire, invincible ignorance or a good conscience on the Day of Judgment it will be known only to God.

Catholic Answers does not know any particular case of a person with the Baptism of Desire. So when we do not know explicitly or implicitly any case with the Baptism of desire how can Alan Schreck and Tim Staples say that everyone needs to enter the Church EXCEPT for those with the Baptism of Desire or who are in invincible ignorance ?

The two apologists have assured their income on EWTN and elsewhere and there are no threats of reprisals with anti Semitism or hate charges.

It is mortal sin to deny an ex cathedra dogma (Cantate Domino,Council of Florence) or to change it (explicit Baptism of Desire). Their sin is manifest in public.

“The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined with Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit by the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgivings, their other works of Christian piety and the duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino, 1441.) Ex cathedra
– from the website Catholicism.org and “No Salvation outside the Church”: Link List, the Three Dogmatic Statements Regarding EENS
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Therefore, all must be converted to Him, made known by the Church's preaching, and all must be incorporated into Him by baptism and into the Church which is His body. For Christ Himself "by stressing in express language the necessity of faith and baptism (cf. Mark 16:16; John 3:5), at the same time confirmed the necessity of the Church, into which men enter by baptism, as by a door.-Ad Gentes 7,Vatican Council II
Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience.-Lumen Gentium 16, Vatican Council II.
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April 30 2010

Time 3:00 PM - 4:00 PM

Title Is There Salvation Outside the Church?

Guest Alan Schreck

Description



BIOGRAPHY: Dr. Alan Schreck has been a professor of theology at Franciscan University of Steubenville since 1978. During this time he has served as director of Graduate Theology for eight years between 1981 and 1999, as chair of the Departments of Theology and Philosophy from 1988-1992, and as chair of the Department of Theology from 1994-1995 and from 1999-2008. Enrollment in the theology program has grown from 20 to 30 students when Dr. Schreck began teaching to over 550 students in both undergraduate and graduate theology programs in 2009.

Dr. Schreck was awarded the Faculty Campus Leadership and Teaching Award at Franciscan University in 2000.

As a theology professor, Dr. Schreck has taught classes on the teachings of Vatican II, Church Renewal, Historical Foundations, and Theology of the Holy Spirit at the graduate level, and Theology of the Church, Theology of Christ, Early Christian Life and Thought, and Christian Life and Thought in Modern Times and other theology electives at the undergraduate level.

Dr. Schreck is well-respected for his expertise in the teachings of the Second Vatican Council and their impact on the Catholic Church today. Through his classes and writings he works to tell the truth about what Vatican II really teaches, believing, like Pope John Paul II, that the council was "a great gift of God to the Church in the 20th century." He writes a monthly column on the documents of Vatican II and the encyclical letters of Pope John Paul II in The Sower, an international journal for Catholic catechetics.

Dr. Schreck also specializes in Catholic Church history, Catholic Church doctrine, Church Renewal and the theology of the Church. He has written a best-selling book on Catholic apologetics, Catholic and Christian: An Explanation of Commonly Misunderstood Catholic Beliefs, which was reprinted in 2004 after selling a third of a million copies. Dr. Schreck co-hosts each summer with Dr. Scott Hahn an apologetics conference at Franciscan University, the Defending the Faith Conference, which draws over 1,200 attendees each year.

In the summer of 2008, Dr. Schreck traveled to Italy to participate in a six-week seminar sponsored by the National Endowment for the Humanities on St. Francis in the 13th century, studying art and literature in Rome, Siena, and Assisi. Led by Franciscan scholars, Schreck and 15 other college and university professors did intensive research at the Franciscan library in the Capuchin Generalate outside of Rome, viewed Franciscan art in churches, art galleries and other collections, and participated in seminar discussions on early Franciscan texts.

Because of his Franciscan studies and long career at Franciscan University, Dr. Schreck is deeply interested in Church renewal, with the example of St. Francis and his call from God to "rebuild my Church." His newest book on the subject is Rebuild My Church! God’s Plan for Authentic Catholic Renewal, from St. Anthony Messenger Press (March 2010).

Dr. Schreck has published many other books, including Compact History of the Catholic Church (2009), Your Life in the Holy Spirit: What Every Catholic Needs to Know and Experience (2007), Catholic and Christian for Young Adults: Questions and Answers about the Faith (2007), Vatican II: The Crisis and the Promise (2005), Catholic Church History from A to Z: An Inspirational Dictionary (2002), and The Essential Catholic Catechism: A Readable, Comprehensive Catechism of the Catholic Faith (2000). He co-wrote Epic: A Journey Through Church History with Steve Weidenkopf in 2009, and a foreword for The Action of the Holy Spirit: The Lord and Giver of Life by Frank J. Sheed in 2006.

Dr. Schreck received his Doctorate in Theology from University of St. Michael’s College in Toronto, Ontario, in 1979. His dissertation was "Ronald Knox’s Theory of Enthusiasm and its Application to the Catholic Charismatic Renewal." He also holds a Master of Arts degree in Theology from University of St. Michael’s College and a Bachelor of Arts degree Summa Cum Laude in Theology and English from University of Notre Dame.

In addition to his regular column in The Sower, Dr. Schreck has written for Catholic Digest, God’s Word Today, Catholic Charismatic, The Family, Immaculata, Catholic Parent, Faith and Renewal, New Covenant, California Mission, Franciscan Way magazines and many others.

Dr. Schreck is a speaker at numerous Catholic conferences for the laity as well as for academic, diocesan, catechetical, and parish renewal events. His television series, "The Catholic Challenge: Vatican II and You" aired on EWTN, and he has made appearances on several EWTN shows, including "Mother Angelica Live" and "Franciscan University Presents."

Schreck belongs to the American Catholic Historical Association and the Fellowship of Catholic Scholars, and attends yearly seminars in American Church History at the University of Notre Dame.

Dr. Schreck and his wife, Nancy, teach Pre-Cana marriage preparation classes on the spirituality of marriage together, both at Franciscan University and in a local Catholic deanery.

Dr. Schreck enjoys running and working with youth, so he volunteers as a track coach for the Steuben Striders, a summer youth track program. An Eagle Scout, he serves as the assistant scoutmaster for Boy Scout Troop 401 and enjoys backpacking and camping. He is also an assistant coach for Franciscan University’s NCAA Div. III Track and Field team.

Alan and Nancy Schreck live in Steubenville, where they have raised their children: Paul, Jeanne, Mark, Margaret, and Peter. He is a member of Triumph of the Cross parish.